slam fires

This is a discussion on slam fires within the Rifles forums, part of the Sniping Related category; I have heard of slam fires in ARs but never had one happen is this a common thing?...

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Thread: slam fires

  1. #1
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    slam fires

    I have heard of slam fires in ARs but never had one happen
    is this a common thing?
    I take things and make them better

  2. #2
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    Re: slam fires

    Quote Originally Posted by trapperjack1
    I have heard of slam fires in ARs but never had one happen. Is this a common thing?
    Not if the firing pin and it's channel are kept clean. Slam fires are caused by a stuck firing pin that protrudes enough to ignite the primers as the bolt goes forward. It's also possible that a broken firing pin could also stick forward. I don't believe it's common at all.

    The firing pin is free floating and doesn't have a return spring as can be clearly seen in this Colt AR-15 IPB: http://stevespages.com/ipb-colt-ar15.html

  3. #3
    Senior Member crockett007's Avatar
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    Re: slam fires

    Quote Originally Posted by trapperjack1
    I have heard of slam fires in ARs but never had one happen
    is this a common thing?
    It's my perception that they are a lot more common with the M1A and M14 platform. I seem to recall during my Army days that it was a concern on the rifle range (M14). Been too may years ago for me to recall specifics.

    I did see a fellow (forced to)leave a range one time because the RO noticed he was shooting an M1A with handloads. He was cease fired and the RO said due to slamfire concerns he either had to use factory ammo or di-di mao. (high primers maybe?).

    I can't recall ever seeing an AR or M16 do this.

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    If by slam fire you mean when the butt of the rifle hits the ground and a round is fired? If so I have seen it first hand on a M16A2. Someone in our Battalion had a live round chambered in his M16A2 in the bleachers.We where at a night time live fire at the qualifying range. Must have chambered it after leaving the range because all weapons get cleared before you leave the range.

    Any how he had a chambered round and dropped the rifle butt first on to the bleacher and the round fired. My A team leader at the time had his POV at the range and he grabbed me and the B team leader; we jumped in his car and split just before they closed down the range.

    Yeah I know you can't put weapons in a POV, but we did and nobody was the wiser. The battalion didn't finish up until 0100; we left at 2100.

    Any way never seen it with an AR 15 if that's what you meant by a slam fire.

    Jamie

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    this post contains some interesting accounts of slamfires

    http://thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=6 ... ostcount=9


    perhaps you could add your m16 story to his colleciton

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    Slam fires are not to be confused with trigger malfunctions such as likely caused the idiot to send a round toward space by tossing the rifle on th bleachers...if that is what really happened at all. If the weapon were "cleared" then it would have been CLEAR and FLAGGED. The act of inserting a chamber flag requires that one first EMPTY the CHAMBER. In the dark, this is easily confirmed by locking the bolt back, and running a finger into the loading port to feel the chamber. I'll leave that alone from here on out, as it wasn't anyone around here.



    Slam fires can and DO occur with the AR-15/M-16 rifle as a simple result of the design not including a firing pin retaining spring. When you chamber a round, the firing pin (clean or not) nearly always slams forward onto the back of the primer when the bolt and bolt carrier stops, normally "dimpling" the primer. If the primer is seated high, is in any way defective, or is a softer cup primer such as Federal Gold Medal Match, it can send that bullet downrange unintentionally.

    When handloading, the best way to ensure this never happens is to seat your primers carefully and at least 0.004" below the case head, and use only hard cup primers like Remington 7.5/6.5, CCI, or the CCI MilSpec Primers. Federal GMM is a no no in AR-15s.

    When shooting, the best way to ensure that the eventual slamfire doesn't cause any harm is to....FOLLOW your SAFETY RULES. Keep the muzzle downrange and in the dirt when you close the bolt. This way, if the eventual ND/AD occurs, nobody dies. Kapish?

    Do not single feed the AR-15 by dropping rounds into the chamber, as this allows the bolt to speed forward without the resistance of pushing a round forward out of the magazine, and then hit a stationary target.


    The M-14 and Garand tend to slam fire more than the AR for the simple reason that their firing pins weigh more, so they dimple the primer with more force. They are VERY prone to slam firing if you drop a round into the chamber, and then slam the bolt home...baddd juju.

    -Nate
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by natdscott
    Slam fires are not to be confused with trigger malfunctions such as likely caused the idiot to send a round toward space by tossing the rifle on th bleachers...if that is what really happened at all. If the weapon were "cleared" then it would have been CLEAR and FLAGGED. The act of inserting a chamber flag requires that one first EMPTY the CHAMBER. In the dark, this is easily confirmed by locking the bolt back, and running a finger into the loading port to feel the chamber. I'll leave that alone from here on out, as it wasn't anyone around here.

    -Nate
    Well since I was there and saw the tracer round go through the tin roof over the bleachers it is what happened. Also, he was cleared off the range. He chambered the round after he left the range.

    Jamie

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by beck.jamie
    He chambered the round after he left the range.
    That's a problem. You know the guy? Hope he ran some for that little slip.

    -Nate
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by natdscott
    Quote Originally Posted by beck.jamie
    He chambered the round after he left the range.
    That's a problem. You know the guy? Hope he ran some for that little slip.

    -Nate
    I don't know exactly what happened to him. I know he got an article 15. He was Alpha Co. and I was Delta Co.. I was only sitting about ten guys away from the nuckle head when it happened.

    Jamie

  10. #10
    Senior Member Davy's Avatar
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    Re: slam fires

    Quote Originally Posted by crockett007
    Quote Originally Posted by trapperjack1
    I have heard of slam fires in ARs but never had one happen
    is this a common thing?
    I did see a fellow (forced to)leave a range one time because the RO noticed he was shooting an M1A with handloads. He was cease fired and the RO said due to slamfire concerns he either had to use factory ammo or di-di mao. (high primers maybe?).

    I can't recall ever seeing an AR or M16 do this.
    At first I thought that RO was a little harsh but then I remembered an incident I had some years ago. I was the proud owner of a replica M1 Carbine made by Erma in .22 calibre. It was a delight both to look at and shoot. However, occasionally it would fire off two or three rounds on full automatic when the trigger was pulled with the intention of firing only one on semi automatic! One day, it discharged while I was chambering a round. Fortunately, I was on my own and, from force of habit, had the muzzle pointing in a safe direction (It reinforced, for me, the need to have several lines of defence when it comes to gun safety.) My only offence seems to have been to allow the return spring to do its job and chamber the round.

    As I recall the culprit was the extractor which, sometimes, when loading or firing, acted like a firing pin as it hit the rimfire case. It was some time ago now but I seem to recall indentations on the rim consistent with the shape of the extractor. Perhaps a good gunsmith could have cured the problem but, very reluctantly, that little Erma M1 Carbine and I parted company soon after.

    I have seen the lethal effects of the deceptively humble .22 rimfire on human beings, so full marks to that RO for doing his job and preventing a possible slamfire tragedy with the mighty M1-A!
    'And then it was that I could see the power of God helped men if they would only trust Him."
    (Sergeant Alvin C. York)

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