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I have been loading 308 175SMK with 4064 for my Savage 10FCP with HS stock using Winchester brass and Rem. LR primers.

I then started using Federal cases (from the GMM I shot) and got approx. 20fps increase in velocity (the Federal cases I measured were about 20 grain heavier than the Winchester). I recently switched over to Wolf LR primers and gained another 30fps.

OK, so down to some questions:
Does anyone have any info with using Lapua brass vs Win. or Fed. as to the velocity difference I should expect.

Also I noticed that one of my accuracy node for 168SMK or 175SMK (the load I'm using) is the same velocity as Federal GMM.

Am I right in assuming that this is no accident and that Federal have chosen a velocity that works well with "most" rifles?

Also when working up a load, say for Lapua brass, should I just aim for the same velocity as my other accuracy loads (the same velocity as FGMM).

Cheers,
Dave
 

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I use nothing but Fed. brass and lap. for my 300 win.

They were the only once that came out to be with in one grain of each other.

The win an rem brass have never showed good constancy for me.

For the primers i have always used fed and cci




Tom
 

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British Bob said:
Also when working up a load, say for Lapua brass, should I just aim for the same velocity as my other accuracy loads (the same velocity as FGMM).

Cheers,
Dave
In a way yes.... but I wouldn't load for velocity... I'd load for accuracy... load a range of loads increase by no more than 0.5gr and see where you accuracy is the best...then chrono that...

What I noticed is that the accuracy will get very good and remain that way for a range approx 1.5gr of powder... then after that I go and test to see if the velocity increases at all and pick the load w/ the highest velocity in the range of "accurate" loads.

Example... 44gr of IMR 4064, hornady brass, 168gr SMK, 2.800" OAL... this was sub 0.3MOA 4 shot group out of my 10FP, at an average of 2780fps...I then found that 45.2gr yeilded the same accuracy but gave me 2825fps average.... so I stuck with that one... any higher and I started to get slightly flattened primers and cases sticking a little.

MIke.
 

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Consistency is the key here !
Find your low node and then the high node.
Some primers will provide a tad better accuracy with certain powders. Like Varget and CCI BR2 with Winchester brass is a great combo with 168 MK. 1992 Palma match brass made by Winchester was a favorite because of its capacity compared to others.
 

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Velocity will change given all other things being equal based on variations in case capacity. Case capacity, in my experience does vary with manufacturer and sometimes even with cases from the same lots.

When I first started reloading, I tried to get brass from the range. Eventually I found through trial and error that I also had to sort them by MFG. But I never got the accuracy I wanted until I started getting focused on keeping every detail in the reloading process consistent including case manufacturers.

When I first started shooting my 308 I got 200 rounds of factory GMM 168Gr with the intent of reloading the cases. I went to a 1000 yd range and I found out that the 168SMK's couldn't hit the 1000 yd mark due the the boat tail geometry being a bit off according to a reliable source. I started using loading 175 SMKs and Bergers and problem was solved at 1000yds regarding accuracy . My problem with Federal Cases was that at about 5-7 reloads, some of the the primer pockets on the Federal Brass started getting sloppy. I changed to Lapua and never looked back for my 308, and 6.5CM. My reload count with Lapua went way up. I did get some Peterson back for on of my 6.5CM's but that was a while back.

I try to do the load development with components that actually are available which is why I used 4064 instead of Varget for my 308. For the longest time, Varget was just not available.

I realize that what I do might be a bit extreme, but when I have a rifle built, I get enough brass and other components to burn out the barrel based on a reasonably expected round count and brass expected reload counts after I fugure out my go-to load recipe. I keep that brass labeled for that weapon with a card in the ammo box indicating the reload count of the rounds in the box and reload recipe. I probably over bought but I got 500 cases for my 308 and each of my 6.5CMs.

I go through a fairly extensive load development process to get the accuracy I like, and I dont care to mess with going thru the process every time I have to change a component due to availability, so my purchases reflect that desire. Being single I don't have to explain to anyone why the credit card statements have hefty charges to reloading suppliers. I had to question my sanity after I got a few CC monster statements. I get 2 (8lb) jugs of powder at a time and insure they and all my other components are of the same lot as an example. By the way I follow the load development process outlined in the article on the Primal Rights website. No I have no financial interest in the company but I am a happy customer of theirs.

From my perspective, if you can afford it, buying in bulk and insisting on the same MFG lots is the way to go IMO. The problem is now we have some reloading component supply issues that need to be fixed. Getting a straight answer as to what's the cause seems to be a challenge. One thing that is apparent is that someone in the supply chain seized the opportunity to increase prices far in excess of the increases in costs and blame it on inflation.

I still have a bunch of 308 Lapua brass loaded up with 175SMK's, in the box but they're gathering dust as I like shooting my 6.5CMs more.

I realized just how sick I was when I told a friend, who was and still is a casual shooter, that I weighed and sorted my bullets and my cases and boxed them accordingly when I get my bulk purchases in. Still remember that look. Priceless. The thing is, due to current prices I, haven't made a bulk purchase in well over a year in protest of component prices.

Just my .02.

Martino
 

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Velocity will change given all other things being equal based on variations in case capacity. Case capacity, in my experience does vary with manufacturer and sometimes even with cases from the same lots.

When I first started reloading, I tried to get brass from the range. Eventually I found through trial and error that I also had to sort them by MFG. But I never got the accuracy I wanted until I started getting focused on keeping every detail in the reloading process consistent including case manufacturers.

When I first started shooting my 308 I got 200 rounds of factory GMM 168Gr with the intent of reloading the cases. I went to a 1000 yd range and I found out that the 168SMK's couldn't hit the 1000 yd mark due the the boat tail geometry being a bit off according to a reliable source. I started using loading 175 SMKs and Bergers and problem was solved at 1000yds regarding accuracy . My problem with Federal Cases was that at about 5-7 reloads, some of the the primer pockets on the Federal Brass started getting sloppy. I changed to Lapua and never looked back for my 308, and 6.5CM. My reload count with Lapua went way up. I did get some Peterson back for on of my 6.5CM's but that was a while back.

I try to do the load development with components that actually are available which is why I used 4064 instead of Varget for my 308. For the longest time, Varget was just not available.

I realize that what I do might be a bit extreme, but when I have a rifle built, I get enough brass and other components to burn out the barrel based on a reasonably expected round count and brass expected reload counts after I fugure out my go-to load recipe. I keep that brass labeled for that weapon with a card in the ammo box indicating the reload count of the rounds in the box and reload recipe. I probably over bought but I got 500 cases for my 308 and each of my 6.5CMs.

I go through a fairly extensive load development process to get the accuracy I like, and I dont care to mess with going thru the process every time I have to change a component due to availability, so my purchases reflect that desire. Being single I don't have to explain to anyone why the credit card statements have hefty charges to reloading suppliers. I had to question my sanity after I got a few CC monster statements. I get 2 (8lb) jugs of powder at a time and insure they and all my other components are of the same lot as an example. By the way I follow the load development process outlined in the article on the Primal Rights website. No I have no financial interest in the company but I am a happy customer of theirs.

From my perspective, if you can afford it, buying in bulk and insisting on the same MFG lots is the way to go IMO. The problem is now we have some reloading component supply issues that need to be fixed. Getting a straight answer as to what's the cause seems to be a challenge. One thing that is apparent is that someone in the supply chain seized the opportunity to increase prices far in excess of the increases in costs and blame it on inflation.

I still have a bunch of 308 Lapua brass loaded up with 175SMK's, in the box but they're gathering dust as I like shooting my 6.5CMs more.

I realized just how sick I was when I told a friend, who was and still is a casual shooter, that I weighed and sorted my bullets and my cases and boxed them accordingly when I get my bulk purchases in. Still remember that look. Priceless. The thing is, due to current prices I, haven't made a bulk purchase in well over a year in protest of component prices.

Just my .02.

Martino
Sounds like you took the same path I did, except I went with a 6.5 PRC. 😁 Though I still enjoy shooting my .308 a lot . . . particularly because it's cheaper to do so. ;)
 

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6.5PRC may be my next iteration but I have a lot of barrel left in my two 6.5CM bolt guns and my AR 6.5CM isn't even broken in. The greed of whoever it is that is the problem with pricing in our components supply chain has me shooting less as a matter of protest on principle.
 

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I don't chase velocity but my 168 SMK node is 43.4 grains with Winchester brass, 43 with Lapua, Federal and LC.
43.4 is a low node
I use 44.5 of IMR 4064 in WW cases with 165/168 I considered this a high node .
IMR 4064 excellent choice for powder for 308 Win
 

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I have been loading 308 175SMK with 4064 for my Savage 10FCP with HS stock using Winchester brass and Rem. LR primers.

I then started using Federal cases (from the GMM I shot) and got approx. 20fps increase in velocity (the Federal cases I measured were about 20 grain heavier than the Winchester). I recently switched over to Wolf LR primers and gained another 30fps.

OK, so down to some questions:
Does anyone have any info with using Lapua brass vs Win. or Fed. as to the velocity difference I should expect.

Also I noticed that one of my accuracy node for 168SMK or 175SMK (the load I'm using) is the same velocity as Federal GMM.

Am I right in assuming that this is no accident and that Federal have chosen a velocity that works well with "most" rifles?

Also when working up a load, say for Lapua brass, should I just aim for the same velocity as my other accuracy loads (the same velocity as FGMM).

Cheers,
Dave
[/QUOTE
43.4 is a low node
I use 44.5 of IMR 4064 in WW cases with 165/168 I considered this a high node .
IMR 4064 excellent choice for powder for 308 Win
I have been loading 308 175SMK with 4064 for my Savage 10FCP with HS stock using Winchester brass and Rem. LR primers.

I then started using Federal cases (from the GMM I shot) and got approx. 20fps increase in velocity (the Federal cases I measured were about 20 grain heavier than the Winchester). I recently switched over to Wolf LR primers and gained another 30fps.

OK, so down to some questions:
Does anyone have any info with using Lapua brass vs Win. or Fed. as to the velocity difference I should expect.

Also I noticed that one of my accuracy node for 168SMK or 175SMK (the load I'm using) is the same velocity as Federal GMM.

Am I right in assuming that this is no accident and that Federal have chosen a velocity that works well with "most" rifles?

Also when working up a load, say for Lapua brass, should I just aim for the same velocity as my other accuracy loads (the same velocity as FGMM).

Cheers,
Dave
Got me thinking since I only reload brass labeled 7.62 × 51 NATO for my .308 because they can handle being loaded a little hotter and they've performed well in my Savage Axis with no issues. Never thought about using any other brass to check for any differences. I only use 7.62 × 51 brass because of them being a little thicker in the neck and shoulder areas so I'm just following what my grandfather was shooting.
 
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