[BlindasaMole]

Well don't ask me under which rock I have been hiding the last 2 decades but I am surprised to find that nobody uses the good old 8mm Mauser round anymore?

I see the trend is now for smaller calibres with higher velocity.

Can anybody bring me up to date please?


Regards, Blind

 

[Madison]

I started seeing the mauser cartridge decline when the .17 hornady got into its full hype. It should come back to popularity soon and if it doesnt buy some brass and handload.

 

[mele]

The ol 8mm mauser is a very good cartridge. It served very well, but besides surplus rifles it has fallen from favor. I think the total dominance of the .30-06 in the market has hurt the 8mm. They are similar cartridges. But hey, if you like the 8mm Mauser, then by all means get one! Ammo is still commercially available for it, and you can get custom rifles chambered in it.

MEL

 

[Jake S]

I suppose you mean for hunting? Because a lot of third world countries still use it as a sniper cartridge, in rifles such as the Mosin Nagant M91-30 rifle, and the SHE-57, which is a rifle that looks quite a bit similar to the Dragunov rifle but is chambered for the 8x57mm round.

Jake

 

[muzzleblast]

Its kinda sad how 8mm mauser never caught on here in North America as much as it should have. Where I live, lots of people hunt with/own surplus rifles, mostly Lee Enfields. 8 milly mauser is loaded by the big boys to about the same standards as .303 Brit, because they know its mostly being used in older weapons, but the cartridge is capable of a lot more...just about anything a 30-06 can do anyway. For someone who wants to build a sporter out of a surplus gun they can find in excellent shape for hardly two hundred dollars, its a great place to start. Mauser actions in good shape are pretty tough.

 

[Yimmy]

I never really understood what makes new rounds better than old ones.

I am no expert on bullets, but I know the basics such as case length etc.

But, I look at an old round such as the rimless 7x64mm, and to me that sounds like a great bullet; what with a traditional 7mm bullet, not much smaller than .30 cal rounds, in such a long case. Yet, such a round is not as "powerful" as new ones such as the 7mm remington magnum (I can't remember the case length, but it isn't more than 64mm's is it?).

Is it that the old rounds case is thinner so it can't withstand the newer powders? Could anyone explain to me...

 

[morpheus]

Yimmy:

There are a couple of reasons why new rounds are more powerfull than older ones. (This is just what I think, I could be wrong). But older rifles had barrels that were not as tough as today. And, I believe, that different powder has been made for hotter rounds (the .223 WSSM comes to mind, you could've of seen that kind of rifle 50 years ago, the barrels would die so fast, a 40 grain bullet going at 4,500 fps is fast).

It has just been a combination of older rifles with there barrels and powder being advanced. A good example of this would be the 6.5X55 Swede, manufactures keep the round mild because of old rifles. In contrast a .260 is hotter round but still smaller.

I hope I've made a little bit of sense with this post.

 

[muzzleblast]

I think its just that a lot of new rounds were designed to give a little better performance than specific old rounds.

For the most part, lots of useful classics are alive and well, at least here in NA. I don't know much about Europe other than 8 mm, 6.5X55, and 7.62X54R. Here though, 30-06, .30-30 win, and things like that still thrive, and lots of newer rounds used them as a starting point.

Some new rounds are more powerful than older ones because they were developed by wildcatters too, and then factories pick them up and chamber guns in them. Stuff like .243 win, 22/250, and the like.

 

[Max338]

back in the 1940s, the 8mm mauser was actually more powerfull than a 30-06 by quite a bit. the remmington rounds are weak compared to the old mausers cus their not loaded nearly as hot... and mausers lasted for ever....

 

[Jeff_850]

any reason WHY they made them so much weaker?
the real 8mm Mauser was a great round and Remington loads them to get only about 2000 ft-lbs of energy if im not mistaken the origional is a more powerful round than the .30-06 Springfield or even the 7mm Remington magnum, about as powerful as the .300 Winchester Magnum?
yet the .308 can do anything that the new 8mm loads can do but the old ones coulda put the .308 to shame

 

[muzzleblast]

Maybe remington is worse than the others, but federal and winchester load a pretty lazy 8 mm too.

Old guns are definately a factor, I guess, but I've heard people speculate that they just didn't want a euro-bullet cleaning the clocks of our favorites too.

 

[Max338]

thats probably true. here in the USA we like our classics so we stick with them... in europe, i bet they got their own manufacturing plants for ammo so its a lil different there. Yes the old Mauser rounds got like 2800ftlbs of energy at the muzzle and could actually outperform the 30-06. the bullet on the 30-06 was lighter, and remarkably slower than the mauser. the loads nowadays is really weak. these countries that use mausers as SRs use the old type.

 

[Jeff_850]

there are .30-06 loads that go to 3000+ ft-lbs of energy

 

[muzzleblast]

True that.

Federal vital shok lists a 168 grain trophy bonded bear claw at 3,000 fps for 3, 300 ft lbs...thats pretty nasty, and theres lots of other high energy loads too. Thats in the lower end of 300 win mag territory.

 

[Jeff_850]

id be careful what fireams you use those high energy rounds in
heh see the Federal Gold Medal 155 gr BTHP? 155 gr @ 2950 fps... that comes out to 2995 ft-lbs of energy
now someting tells me that they either have an error on my catlog or they mean 30" barrel instead of a 24" but if thats correct that owuld be another example of that heh
either way if im not mistaken with modern powders you would never actually fill the case fully now adays so if you have a stronger gun there would be room to improve velcoity?
i dont reload and im really no expert on that though

 

[muzzleblast]

Actually I was planning to use those loads in an old beat up 1903 with a crack in the receiver...

Just kiddin...yeah those are strictly modern strong hunting rifle loads. Its pretty cool though, that the old 06 can still give that kinda performance!

Hmm...not sure about those loads you mentioned either. I have some listings here or a 150 grain ballistic tip from Federal at 2,900 fps and 2800 ft lbs of energy. A little different.

 

[Jeff_850]

just imagine whta a .300 WM would do if it was loaded with the same powders and you used the full case capacity for them
probably blow up but boy would those be some high muzzle velocities

ps dont try that at home

 

[muzzleblast]

Those high energy loads give 3,800 ft lbs I think :twisted:

Whoa, didn't see what you said about full case capacity! thats wild!

Ever see what a Lazzeroni 7.82 Warbird can do?

 

[Jeff_850]

nope what is the 7.82 never herd of it

 

[Max338]

if were talkin about the same warbird... the Lazzeroni warbird all i can say is... "OUCH" those things zoom out the bbl at like 3800fps with like 4000 ftlbs of energy :shock: