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Discussion Starter #161
Oh lol.. hopefully the gun gods will show you mercy:)

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I forgot to mention. In order to avoid the “we need a new tool for this” I dropped off the ones I bought. I was all hooked up and ready to go. Then there was this cheap torque wrench... you know the saying “that threw a wrench in my plans”? Lol


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I forgot to mention. In order to avoid the “we need a new tool for this” I dropped off the ones I bought. I was all hooked up and ready to go. Then there was this cheap torque wrench... you know the saying “that threw a wrench in my plans”? Lol


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I hope the smith is fair about this. It really isn't a time consuming job to do what they have to do

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Discussion Starter #164
I hope the smith is fair about this. It really isn't a time consuming job to do what they have to do

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I already got the “tomorrow I’m gonna need to get a special torque wrench. Then I’ll stay late just to work in this job”. I know what that means.


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That sounds like a load. Back out a broken screw out of a hole.... I don't think that requires any kind of a torque wrench.
 

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That sounds like a load. Back out a broken screw out of a hole.... I don't think that requires any kind of a torque wrench.
Nope, ive had to do it before. It does help if you have equipment to assist but a screw that small and a touch of light heat i.would think it would release easily

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I already got the “tomorrow I’m gonna need to get a special torque wrench. Then I’ll stay late just to work in this job”. I know what that means.


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I gotta agree with Martino1, that sounds like a crock , even if its in there with permatight, a good hairdryer would be enough to release its hold and then i could come up with several ways to back it out. Worse case would be using a drill press (you have to let the bit do the cutting so you don't break it also)drill it out just under the thread size then you can peel out the shell thats left.. done it before on 3/4 in screws and 4mm screws.. possibly have to use the correct size tap to clean up when your done but I bet it would more than likely come out with a small hole drilled and a easy out and a blow dryer or hot air gun to make sure the loctite will let go.

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In my opinion, give the smith a fair chance. Wait and see what he charges as it might be quite fair. If you dropped your rifle off without getting an “estimate” you are kind of stuck paying whatever he says anyway. This is why I only deal with smiths that I trust. I don’t ask TS Customs what the price is, I know upfront that the price will be fair and the work will be perfect.

Keep in mind also that while this might not be an overly difficult project, it can be time consuming to deal with broken off screws. Good smiths have plenty of work, and usually the work is less time consuming than broken screws. Therefore the broken screw would demand pay fitting to the time it takes, not the complexity of the task. There is a reason the gun is at the smith instead of on your bench at home.

Also keep in mind the massive overhead that smiths have to deal with. Taxes, ffl fees, LLC fees, business license, atf audits, tools, employees wages, light bills, workers comp, business insurance, and the list goes on and on. I understand why smiths don’t just say “buy me a coke and we are even”.

First off, I hope his work is done right. Second, I hope he charges you fairly. A far third would be I hope he gets it done soon so you can get back to shooting.
 

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In my opinion, give the smith a fair chance. Wait and see what he charges as it might be quite fair. If you dropped your rifle off without getting an “estimate” you are kind of stuck paying whatever he says anyway. This is why I only deal with smiths that I trust. I don’t ask TS Customs what the price is, I know upfront that the price will be fair and the work will be perfect.

Keep in mind also that while this might not be an overly difficult project, it can be time consuming to deal with broken off screws. Good smiths have plenty of work, and usually the work is less time consuming than broken screws. Therefore the broken screw would demand pay fitting to the time it takes, not the complexity of the task. There is a reason the gun is at the smith instead of on your bench at home.

Also keep in mind the massive overhead that smiths have to deal with. Taxes, ffl fees, LLC fees, business license, atf audits, tools, employees wages, light bills, workers comp, business insurance, and the list goes on and on. I understand why smiths don’t just say “buy me a coke and we are even”.

First off, I hope his work is done right. Second, I hope he charges you fairly. A far third would be I hope he gets it done soon so you can get back to shooting.
Definitely guess i can't argue with that. Reckon you gotta give them the chance to be fair and handle it.

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Discussion Starter #170
Definitely guess i can't argue with that. Reckon you gotta give them the chance to be fair and handle it.

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Yeah, I agree. Let’s see if he does the right thing. But man..... I was SO CLOSE to doing it myself. Lol.


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Yeah, I agree. Let’s see if he does the right thing. But man..... I was SO CLOSE to doing it myself. Lol.


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The more you start collecting and modify, the more you will start to jump on the curve. I was fortunate, I have a old timer smith where I live that has been willing to teach me his trade

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Discussion Starter #172
All I did was try to take off the rail before I called you for the guidance. Then (of course) this happens. It’s amazing. It’s always something.


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All I did was try to take off the rail before I called you for the guidance. Then (of course) this happens. It’s amazing. It’s always something.


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Yeah, sometimes little glitches can slow things down.. just gotta remember them and think how to prevent it next time. Like almost always (probably should have mentioned it to you) when working on a rifle that I have not worked on like in your case, I probably would have heated the screw with a soldering iron just to make sure there wasn't anything holding it. On small screws like that if I do loctite them I literally use dip a needle I a tiny drop let just enough on to cover one maybe 2 threads closest to the head of the screw that way when heating it it.doesnt take much heat and I only have to get one turn before I'm free from the loctite but as a general rule I try not use it. I will torque to spec and double check after each use and decide from there. I always use a little on the grip screw in AR rifles because they my be stubborn to get out but they won't break(at least yet) but there are very few instances where I use thread lock.

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Discussion Starter #174
Yeah, sometimes little glitches can slow things down.. just gotta remember them and think how to prevent it next time. Like almost always (probably should have mentioned it to you) when working on a rifle that I have not worked on like in your case, I probably would have heated the screw with a soldering iron just to make sure there wasn't anything holding it. On small screws like that if I do loctite them I literally use dip a needle I a tiny drop let just enough on to cover one maybe 2 threads closest to the head of the screw that way when heating it it.doesnt take much heat and I only have to get one turn before I'm free from the loctite but as a general rule I try not use it. I will torque to spec and double check after each use and decide from there. I always use a little on the grip screw in AR rifles because they my be stubborn to get out but they won't break(at least yet) but there are very few instances where I use thread lock.

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Ok, here’s the latest. The old smith used Loctite Red. The new smith said he’s gonna use purple this time. He heated it up to 300 and it didn’t budge. So he’s gonna drill it out, and we have the screws coming from Savage. Maybe a week or so more. It just wasn’t meant to be. Any longer and my Criterion will be here. Hahaha


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Ok, here’s the latest. The old smith used Loctite Red. The new smith said he’s gonna use purple this time. He heated it up to 300 and it didn’t budge. So he’s gonna drill it out, and we have the screws coming from Savage. Maybe a week or so more. It just wasn’t meant to be. Any longer and my Criterion will be here. Hahaha


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I've actually when I've had to drill out squarely and tapped to next size up to give them a little more strength and bite.. i reckon I won't doubt he couldn't get them out but I am suprised. Im glad to hear he didn't get it hot enough to alter the forged or heat treatment. I am suprised he used red but that does definitely make it more plausible why they were so difficult to remove . Im glad this guy is on the path to getting you going. In the end I believe you'll be very happy with your criterion. Its good you have the tools to do it yourself. Maybe find a descent donor rifle and get some practice on diy.. as I mentioned I am happy to share any tips to ease the process and have no doubt after 1 or 2 successes you'll look back and see that to just a basic swap on a savage is pretty easy. Keep us posted , im definitely hoping the rest of your journey ends well and that you are very happy with the long game decisions here

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Discussion Starter #177
I've actually when I've had to drill out squarely and tapped to next size up to give them a little more strength and bite.. i reckon I won't doubt he couldn't get them out but I am suprised. Im glad to hear he didn't get it hot enough to alter the forged or heat treatment. I am suprised he used red but that does definitely make it more plausible why they were so difficult to remove . Im glad this guy is on the path to getting you going. In the end I believe you'll be very happy with your criterion. Its good you have the tools to do it yourself. Maybe find a descent donor rifle and get some practice on diy.. as I mentioned I am happy to share any tips to ease the process and have no doubt after 1 or 2 successes you'll look back and see that to just a basic swap on a savage is pretty easy. Keep us posted , im definitely hoping the rest of your journey ends well and that you are very happy with the long game decisions here

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This barrel is the same savage factory barrel that came originally with the gun. The criterion is 4 months away.


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The smith probably with time could get the old screw out. If he does a lot of Smith work, then enlargement of the base screw holes to the next size up will be a very common thing for him. It might be the case that it is easier, less time consuming, and cheaper just to mill them out and start over.

While he is doing this, he should be able to true them up as well. Savage is not known for straight scope base holes and this would correct any issues.

Red loctite has its place even when dealing with guns, but it is few and far between. For sure not to be used on scope bases.
 
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