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Discussion Starter #1
Ok so I just got the cool Magnum Research rifle - Mercedes - a week ago... and signed up for a 4 day precision rifle class... NOW I find out that to qualify for that class I need to take and get a distinguished graduate certificate in a Tactical rifle class...

What's the problem? Well the Tactical rifle class requires you to shoot around 700 rounds in 4 days... WAY more than I want to put through Mercedes... And it tests shooting out to only 200M, but with a time presure.

So now I have to buy ANOTHER rifle for that class, take it, pass with distinction, and only then will they allow me to take the 1st of several precision classes... DAMN!!! :x Since when do I need to qualify for this stuff :p

So the question is what is a CHEAP decent rifle bigger than 22LR that can shoot well to 200M, minimal recoil, and which I don't have to worry about putting 700 rounds through?

Of course to be sure that I pass with distinction I'll probably need to spend 10 hours a week on the range BEFORE I go to Nevada :oops: ... This is getting awfully expensive in a hurry LOL

Ideas guys?

PS - can either be bolt or SA (AK or AR15???)
 

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A used Savage in 223 would be cool...Wouldn't set you back much, still shoots good, cheap ammo...

Ditto for a used ADL.

As for the Semi, heck, how about an SKS? You'll hear some stuff over it I bet, but its not like the other guys will shoot any better.
 

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I'm thinking the .223 is perfect for your short-range tactical class. I know the guys that I've talked to about precision classes would not have let you sign up unless they knew you or you had proven that you already had the required tactical courses. NOt saying you did anything wrong, I'm saying the person offering the course should have verifies that you were "qualified" (meaning you had the other course) first before taking your $$$.

JeffVN
 

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Oh yeah I forgot to say that when you go to the classes, you need to reportback your opinions of the instructors and the class. I've been looking for some classes on precision and tactical rifle for ht ebolt gun (most tactical gun classes want you to have a gas gun). I think these forums are great opportunities to get feedback on courses like the ones you are talking about.

JeffVN
 

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I'm thinking the .223 is perfect for your short-range tactical class. I know the guys that I've talked to about precision classes would not have let you sign up unless they knew you or you had proven that you already had the required tactical courses. NOt saying you did anything wrong, I'm saying the person offering the course should have verifies that you were "qualified" (meaning you had the other course) first before taking your $$$.

JeffVN
 

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If there testing you out to 200 meters (on human sized targets im guessing) your going to want an AR-15... the AK would be fine if it were a nice AK... not neglected or beat up... with some good ammo.Allthough... the AR-15 is obviously more accurate with regular bulk ammo than the AK... but if you have a good AK that isnt beat up or has a neglected barrel... you can pick up some of that Winchester Metric 7.62X39mm ammo and put that through an AK... its actually pretty accurate... i get about pie plate (or mid chest) accuracy with several of my AK's with the Winchester Metric (white box) 7.62X39mm ammo.... wich is fine for 200 meters. But for your average tactical shooter... the AR-15 would be a better choice. Its naturally more accurate with most barrel / upper reciever groups than the AK wich allows you to be faster (and a little more sloppy) on the aiming while still hitting your target.
 

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Jeffvn said:
I'm thinking the .223 is perfect for your short-range tactical class. I know the guys that I've talked to about precision classes would not have let you sign up unless they knew you or you had proven that you already had the required tactical courses. NOt saying you did anything wrong, I'm saying the person offering the course should have verifies that you were "qualified" (meaning you had the other course) first before taking your $$$.

JeffVN
I agree.... why the hell did this place sign you up on a class you were not allowed to take? They probably wont give you back your money either will they... HEH... :? .... They probably signed you up on that course knowing that you would then have to go through there other course to qualify... thereby making them extra $$$ (and costing you extra $$$). I would ask for my money back and seek courses else where.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
LOL = the money is not an issue... all courses are 'free' with my lifetime membership - it's just that if I DON'T get a distinguished certificate, I'll end up missing the May precession class, which isn't offered till Oct again... Of course buying another rifle for the tactical class was not planned either.

Yes Tactical is shooting to 500M, but test is only out to 200. Precision is shooting out to 1000M with test to 600M. All into thoracic cavity size targets.

As far as quality of classes there is no place I can recommend more highly than www.frontsight.com I've taken pistol classes there are they have been excellent. In fact I was so impressed I joined as a lifetime member.
 

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I'll have to go with the .223 Savage on this one. I think it'll be your best combo of accuracy and price. That sucks that you've got to jump through the hoops like that. They let you in the class and then said "Oh, by the way" later? Am I understanding this right? Sucks...
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Kaz said:
I'll have to go with the .223 Savage on this one. I think it'll be your best combo of accuracy and price. That sucks that you've got to jump through the hoops like that. They let you in the class and then said "Oh, by the way" later? Am I understanding this right? Sucks...
Well - I guess I didn't read the fine print... :)
 

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Was it like being in a car commercial? At the end of the guys pitch another guy started talking reeeely fast and a little quieter?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Kaz said:
Was it like being in a car commercial? At the end of the guys pitch another guy started talking reeeely fast and a little quieter?
more like listenig to another friend whos a member there 'ya you can sign up for that cass' and not reading the website details very well...
 

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go with the AR - you can not go wrong (sorry guys, "savage" just makes me shiver)

(and build it yourself) After you kick their ars you can tell them you build it from the ground up as well :lol: and it cost about 1/2 (or less) what their custom AR's did!!

just my .02, go with what fells good to you........bolt.......gas.....whatever
 

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genen said:
As far as quality of classes there is no place I can recommend more highly than www.frontsight.com I've taken pistol classes there are they have been excellent. In fact I was so impressed I joined as a lifetime member.
This place is in Aptos, CA? As in Santa Cruz county?

Scatch Maroo
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Scatch Maroo said:
genen said:
As far as quality of classes there is no place I can recommend more highly than www.frontsight.com I've taken pistol classes there are they have been excellent. In fact I was so impressed I joined as a lifetime member.
This place is in Aptos, CA? As in Santa Cruz county?

Scatch Maroo
They don't have a facility there... that is the business office... range is in nevada...
 

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I was temped to agree with the AR deal, but it just seemed easier to buy an inexpesnive rifle that's more accurate out of the box. I figured "Savage does have it's shortcomings, but it'll be an inexpensive, quick, and accurate way to go". I thought about doing a custom AR myself though, building from a bare reciever up to a complete rifle... Sounds fun.
 

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caver101 said:
go with the AR - you can not go wrong (sorry guys, "savage" just makes me shiver)
My savage is hitting .3 moa or better with me shooting it.
They also won rifle of the year ,in... I believe 2003
and they also won manufacturer of the year at the same time.
Not to easy to pull that off at the same time and they dont give away those awards either you have to earn them.
Hmmm I think they are doing something right. :D
as for remington...dont get me started on mine I hate it already. :cry:
 

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Whats wrong with your Remmy? I heard they were having quality control issues...and not just from Harquebus dude
 

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rem 700 bdl bull barrel 223

It doesnt want to chamber the next shell correctly (from day 1)
The bullet stops just befor entering the chamber.
The tip is getting caught on something it seems like.

I called remington about this (the day after i got it) and they gave me the run around for about 1 1/2 hrs then I just gave up.

If it was one of my customers with a new $700 rifle i think I would
have bent over backwards to get the rifle back repair it and return it.
fo no charge whatsoever.

Probably after service like that I will never endorse Remington again or buy anymore of their products.
 

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Well, thats a bummer!!! I'm sorry to hear that, sure seems like something they would want to address.

MEL
 
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