[wigwamitus]

Maybe I don't know how to work something but I can't get the link at the bottom of the original post to work???? When I click on it it goes to the drop box website but then the website says it doesn't exist.

I get same result as you.

 

[wigwamitus]

Here is the dry fire record for the week 5/12 thru 5/19




==
And here is a field fire report from the week

2014-05-18
1230-1430
70F
8 mph SW

Environment: Clear, partly cloudy, sub was obscured on occasion. Wind from the SW.

Equipment: .22LR, with aimsport 3-9x scope and sling with AM22 40gr 1200fps. .308WIN bolt gun with 168gr AMAX, LP 6.5-20x TMR set at 6.5x and Harris 13-27 inch bipod set at 13 inches.

Goal: Shoot 10rd, 10 spot drill with NPA checks.

Activity:

Fired 10rds of .22LR from upper left clockwise, 1 rd at each dot. These rounds were fired at 60yds.



01 - NAP =3 (rt, rt) ... 3 inches left.

02 - NPA = 2 (lo) ... 2 inches left.

03 - NPA = 2 (rt) ... 1 inch left.

04 - NPA = 2 (lf) ... 1 inch right.

05 - NPA = 1 ... 1 inch left.

06 - NPA = 2 (lf) ... 1 inch down.

07 - NPA = 2 (lo) ... 1 inch down.

08 - NPA = 2 (lo) ... 2 inches down.

09 - NPA = 1 ... 2 inches left.

10 - NPA = 1 ... 2 inches left.

Fired 10rds of 7.62 from upper left clockwise, 1 rd at each dot. These rounds were fired at 109yds.



01 - NPA = 2 (lo) ... 1 inch left

02 - NPA = 2 (rt) ... 1 inch lo-left

03 - NPA = 3 (lf, lo) ... 1 inch left

04 - NPA = 2 (lo) ... 1 inch left

05 - NPA = 1 ... 2 inches lo left

06 - NPA = 1 ... 2 inches left

07 - NPA = 2 (lf) ... 2 inches left

08 - NPA = 2 (rt) ... 1 inch low

09 - NPA = 4 (lt, lo, lo-rt) ... 1 inch low-left

10 - NPA = 1 ... 1 inch left

Summary: Why all the misses to the left? Is it trigger or needing to click?

npa/fire ratio in the field was 1.9

==

Overall weekly summary: I think the "emotional baggage" I bring to the dry fire sessions might be the biggest variable. This causes me to "rush" things instead of relaxing and enjoying. Low score sessions happen when I am relaxed and enjoying and taking my time and high score sessions happen when I am distracted by other thoughts and hurrying. Most of the 6 round dry fire sessions are separated by an hour or more, but not all. I wonder if I should do some sort of 5m "workout" before I dry fire. This might at least shake out some of the physical nervous energy ... and maybe help me transition from work concerns to the task at hand. Kind of like stretching before a run ... I see if I can weave that it.
The .308 dry fires have a better average than the .22LR dry fires, because the bipod is a more stable platform than the sling, at least with me driving the sling. But I might be getting more benefit from the sling shooting. Maybe I will take the bipod off the .308 for next week's dry fires and try it "bone only". I think this .308 "hunting style" rifle is more comfortable to try the bones only with.

I need to find a way to score the results in the field. I think something like this (for 109yds or less):

distance between
POA and POI // score

0-.49 inches // 10
.5 - 1.49 inches // 9
1.5 - 2.49 inches // 8
3.5 - 4.49 inches // 7

measuring from center of aiming point, to center of impact point.

Then I will have two types of scores, the ratio of npa checks to dry or actual fires and the target scores for the actual fires. Ultimately, it is the target scores that matter.

==

Well if no one can read that first "data pic" I might need to come up with a different way to present that data.

The overall weekly average of NPA to dry fires was 1.75 with the best daily average being 1.47 and the worst daily average being 2.0, so quite a lot of variation.

 

[Ravenblack]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/m3j4o2221qfpztw/PRONE TO WIN CD AUGUST 2004.zip

Try that link.

 

[Ravenblack]

Sometimes you get a pinch of luck with your skill...

This 100yd free slung prone match card using aperture sights on a windy & wet day is proof.

NPA, breathing control, wind reading. It all adds up.

With the Match round, the hole left in the card shrinks. This makes it look like it missed the score ring, where as the .22 gauge shows a hit.

A bit of skill & luck & a 100/100 score.

 

[wigwamitus]

Your target looks a little bit different from NRA Small Bore target TQ-4(P), though it is probably the same. One inch bull and two inch 10 ring, right?
Much better than I'll ever do!!!

 

[natdscott]

Your target looks a little bit different from NRA Small Bore target TQ-4(P), though it is probably the same. One inch bull and two inch 10 ring, right?

Not so much. That's an enlargement of the 50m International target...which is itself a reduction of the 300m target.

They are MUCH smaller than our NRA targets...enough that it's like a new sport entirely. I can only say that if you want to immediately start cleaning NRA targets, then start shooting the 50m target. It will make a man out of you.

Our NRA smallbore targets are just reductions of the fullbore targets I shoot on. Much as I like to think they are tough to hit, they are relatively large when you look at the 300m centers.

Much better than I'll ever do!!!

Now that's a bunch of BS if I ever heard it; that's the wrong mentality, and the wrong approach. You can't predict what you will be able to do in the future any more than Raven or I can predict how we'll shoot tomorrow.

You are a good shooter. You will clean targets.

-Nate

 

[Ravenblack]

Your target looks a little bit different from NRA Small Bore target TQ-4(P), though it is probably the same. One inch bull and two inch 10 ring, right?
Much better than I'll ever do!!!

Half that...

I wonder how tight I could get that off of a bi-pod or bag, rather than just off of a sling... Hmmmm.

To the right there is a group of 4 shots covering 1/4 MOA. The wind was at it's lightest at this point.

The light breeze explains the other wayward shots going out to almost 1 MOA worse case.

I hate breezy days! The slightest breeze that'll hardly move a flag is enough to shift the lightweight .22 and lose a point. At least with a stiffer wind you can judge and correct.

As for never being able to do this yourself.... I couldn't once upon a practice, practice, practice ago.

 

[Orkan]

I hate breezy days!

Never come to South Dakota.

 

[Ravenblack]

I like windy. I like rainy. Something I can see and get some entertainment from.

I don't like weak breezes. Weak breezes that don't give any sign of existing... Weak breezes that leave bigger rounds alone, but pick on the little guy .22. Grrr!

Our range is a turbulent PITA. It's in a quarry and an a day with a light wind and heavier gusts, a line of wind flags out to 100yds can all be pointing different ways, then switch in a blink.
It's all good fun once you can read the patterns, but newbies end up in lunatic asylums...

 

[wigwamitus]

For me the toughest kind of wind has been when it is right in my face. If it is cold already, especially sub zero F, then my eyes tear up and I've learned to shoot with goggles on. But the hard part is the wind is rarely exactly in your face and staying there. Today the wind right now is NW and I was shooting to the NW. But I had to correct .22LR by holding left for one target sequence, and then I started the second sequence holding that same amount, and I had to back all the way off the hold, the wind had shifted and I didn't check for that before I started the second sequence. And that has happened to me several times at longer ranges, the wind is mostly head on, but shifts from one side to the other without me detecting it and moves my bullet accordingly. Today, the wind is boxing the compass around here, we have NW 8-12 right now, per the forecast, we will switch to SW, the S, the SE, the E and then before morning back to SE, S, SW and NW again. I'll be going out again tonight, who knows which way the wind will be from.

Hail can be a little scary, I was shooting one day and it started hailing, but the hail was marble sized and poorly formed, so I finished that sequence, than packed up and headed back to put my tractor and tow truck under cover. If big hail hit me in the field, I'd dive under my buggy if it was around and head into the woods if not.

==

Oh, as to 'better than I'll every do' that is part of lowering my expectations of myself, so that I know I am climbing a tall mountain. It helps keep me from getting comfortable, I have a long way to go! But I suspect that will always be the case, and that is fine .

==

Another book to read oh my (link above) ... I looked through it, but haven't "studied" it yet ... I was trying to spend most of my reading time this year on WWI ... McMeekin's "July 1914" for instance. I figured the historians would've figured out what happened in that month by now, but it seems there is still controversy, which leads to more reading ... lots of things to read!

I'm trying to read various manuals, etc. about "how to build a solid position" (shooting that is) but most books, manuals only have scattered sentence about the topic. I haven't found the "Encyclopedia of Solid Position Building" yet, though one guy sent me a draft manual he is working on, that is trying to move in that direction. I have to shoot standing in my fields these days, the grass is too high for other positions and trying to learn how to minimize "wobble". If I stand with feet "fore and aft" I minimize recoil, but the wind can blow ME left and right. If I stand with feet side by side, the left to right wobble is reduce, but the recoil can knock me back, depending on the cartridge. So feet placement is where I'm stuck. Of course, if shooting .22LR I can use the side by side foot placement as there is (almost) no recoil.

 

[wigwamitus]

I can't shoot prone or even sitting on my land any more (well not if I want to shoot at the targets I have setup) ... so having to switch to standing "tripod" and learn to build a solid position with that support. Note this "tripod" is not like a .50 cal tripod, this one is very light, maybe less than 1 pound, more like a bog stick with three legs. You rest the rifle on it and don't push on it or you will tip it over. But with the devices I'm putting on the front of the rifle trying to use sling would be tougher I think too much weight. Anyway, here goes. This is the second attempt you use these night vision devices.

2014-06-07
2200-23
60F
Wind Nil

Environment: Three quarter moon, 80% obscured by cloud. No wind.

Goal: Fire 7.62 with CO-LR NVD and Thermal with purpose of validating match to day zero for both devices.

Equipment: PVS-14 for navigation, 7.62 rifle with LP 3-18x H58 scope. CO-LR NVD, Thermal clip-on. Tripod. 10 rounds 175gr. 930 fps.

Activity: Drove out to target area and replaced target. When to 109yd FP and fired 5rds with CO-LR. Four rounds were grouped fairly well all were a bit low. With no wind my wobble was reduced a bit. I was using NPA checks for each round. Walked down to target with PVS-14 adjusted focus several times to get used to that. Took target pic and headed back to FP.



Switched CO-lR off and attached Thermal clip-on and got up on the tripod.

I was sighting in when I saw a four legged mamamal walking along the top of the berm, I was white hot on the thermal, so the creature was hot. Based on size comparison to my target (the creature walked right above my target) I would say it was 3-4 feet long. It moved like a predator, steady clip. I put my sights on it to keep it in my picture. I had it in my sights for more than 10 but less than 20 seconds. I could not positively ID the creature as either a Coyote or a Bobcat. If I had to guess, I would guess Bobcat based on the headshape, but I've never seen either through a thermal device, so not exactly sure what they look like on thermal.
I then fired my 5 rounds and drove buggy (using PVS-14) to taret and took pic. Then proceeded to RTB. ON the way back I saw the rear end of a creature heading into the woods at a run (as it heard me comming) it had a tail sticking up in the air at about a 45 degree angle behind it and the tail was thick and bushy across its entire length. It disappeared into the woods and I did not see it again.

When on the thermal I could not see the paper or the dots, only the fiber board the paper was attached to. I was trying to aim at the center of the upper right quadrant of the board, which I thought would be the center of the paper. So from that perspective the thermal rounds "missed" ... but they hit where the rifle was aimed and the group isn't too bad considering I have to cycle the charging handle after each round and then reaim.



So, I'm happy with the results from tonight. The shots were not too wild and the equipment worked and I saw my first predetor in through the thermal and from the buggy with the PVS-14.

For purposes of scale those black tape sqaures are 2 inch across.

==
Later: After looking at pictures of Bobcat and Coyote tails, I switching to thinking what I saw was a Coyote. Coyote tails are bigger and bushier, like the one I saw.

 

[wigwamitus]

2014-06-12
1600-1630
70F
5 MPH MW

Activity: Finally found a spot where I could shoot at 25yds, per urging. This was with the 5.56, with EoTech from standing tripod.



The groups were 3 rds each fired from left to right, group sizes (in inches) were:

#1 - 7/8
#2 - 5/8
#3 - 4/8
#4 - 4/8

The first group was fired with non-firing hand on tripod and thumb against rifle. This is how I normally shoot from the tripod, but then I remembered the new idea and the second three groups were fired with non-firing hand on top of rifle (in front of EoTech) pushing down and to the rear. I can't do that in most cases, because typically the rifles have, scopes or clipons up there, but with the EoTech only on the top rail, it can be done.

I'm preparing for my first ever (civilian) training class next Saturday. We will be using 5.56 with sling.

 

[wigwamitus]

Here is new Plinker Arms .22lr upper on pre-existing UT arms lower (for my 5.56) "made in Kansas". This is an all metal upper and installed on the lower easily. It certainly can't compete for .3 inch accuracy with the likes of the "space rifle" ... but for my purposes it will be my new training rifle. I sold my previous .22lr training rifle, a Mossberg 715T.
It has been very wet around here with ankle deep or higher mud near my good target areas. Strategically (for our ranch) this is a good thing, but for my shooting schedule it has not been good.
Things are drying up now and I hope to be shooting again normally soon.

 

[wigwamitus]

2014-06-29
2200-2330
70F

Fired at NRA 50 yards SB targets, standing unsupported 25yds with EOtech and PVS-14 weapons mount. Top 4 targets are with .22LR upper on UT Arms lower. Got 90 points out of 120. Having feed problems which are causing unintended bump fires (on left and right most targets respectively). The bolt release assembly is loose and might need replacing. But PVS-14 with EoTech in NV mode works. This is the first time I'd tried that. I couldn't try ir laser on the rifle as the battery was dead. That on/off switch is too easy to bump and will have to be taped. ON the NRA 50 yd SB targets, the black circle are about 3.75 inches across.



The bottom left 2 targets are m1911 with CT IR grip laster, 10 yds. The laser is "blooming" and ideally should be filtered. FOr the pistol, the PVS-14 is on the helmet mount.

 

[Ravenblack]

I'm now getting used to my new rifle )MP15-22PC) and a new neutral position for dynamic shooting.

All new to me, so a new learning curve. Mind you, prone I am already key-holing at 50yds.

 

[wigwamitus]

2014-06-29
0930-1030
80F
5 mph SE

Environment: Very humid, sweat rolling off ... water accumulating on the equipment ... but not actually raining ... just lots of moisture in the air. Feels more like Florida than Kanasas.

Equipment: Plinker Arms .22LR upper on UT Arms lower. EoTech, with 3x magnifier. PVS-14 weapons mounted with 3x magnifier. Federal AM22 40gr 1200fps. I got 500rds of subsonic Eley match, but while I'm learning this new gear, I'm going to keep shooting the AM22.



Activity: Fired upper row of 4 targets, 3 rds each at twilight with EoTech, 3x magnifier, 25 yds, standing unsupported. Then waited a bit fired lower 4 targets, 3 rds each at night with PVS-14 and 3x magnifier weapons mounted standing unsupported.
I am using the "tac" style standing unsupported position as taught in the class I took last week. You are facing directly at the target, feet side by side, shoulder distance apart, feet at about 30 degree angle, knees bents, leaning forward. I was using "high ready" which meant before I fired I had the target in view over the top of the EoTech. When I gave myself the command to fire, I raised the weapon up to my right eye until I could see the bull meet the reticle, then I fired the three rounds. This is not the way I would do it at longer range, in fact opposite in many ways. But I'm trying to practice what I was taught and there are reasons for the differences that make sense.
On the EoTech, as it gets darker, I crank the illumination intensity lower and lower. Then when going into NV mode with the PVS-14, I crank the intensity back up again.

Using "Army" scoring, from left to right, the top sequence was, 30, 27, 27, 28. In "Army" scoring, the center of the bullet hole must be inside the ring.

The bottom sequence scores were 27, 28, 27, 26.



I found "cheating" by using the magnifiers improves the results. Last weekend at the class, I wore my prescription lens. I almost never wear my "glasses" when I shoot, I wear goggles, but I guess it helps with that "olde man syndrome" OMS disease I picked up along the way .

 

[Ravenblack]

This is the result of a spot on neutral position. In a batch of 4 targets, this one was right in the zone.

I didn't adjust height as I was already scoring top marks per shot, so I stuck with keeping my best group yet.

The low round was the final shot of 5.

This was 50 meters slung (no bag or bipod). Aperture sights (not scoped).

 

[natdscott]

That's a pretty good group, Raven. 6mm center-to-center?



By the way guys, that center "X" circle is just a shade over 0.34 MOA, and Raven holds the rifle his-self. Given a 30" sight radius (maybe a little more), your local, friendly moderator is holding the rifle's muzzle in an area +/- 0.0018" to shoot a groups that size, and executing trigger pulls without disturbing the sights. He is then reloading the rifle and returning to the same hold radius and location to execute another one.

Human hairs fall in a diameter range of 0.003-0.007".

I kid you none that that is serious business; Raven won't toot his own horn, but I will.


Keep training, ya'll. :wink:

-Nate

 

[Ravenblack]

A shade under 6mm due the that last shot. Up until then I couldn't tell if it was 2 or 4 holes. I knew it was more than one due to size/deformity, but it stayed pretty much round.

 

[Orkan]

Raven won't toot his own horn, but I will.

ESPECIALLY with a rimfire. I know guys that can't do that with a centerfire, 25x optic, bipod, and rear support. LOTS of them, actually. Getting a 22lr shooting that well is one thing... being able to deploy aperture sights to that degree is entirely another. So have another toot on the horn from me. (... and I don't hand those out easy)