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Discussion Starter #1
With the paper with the one inch squares on it, @200yds, my groupings are within a 6 sq inch range. I breathe slowly and deep. I slowly engage the trigger as I exhale. I’m using a Leupold 4-12 scope. The gun is a Savage Stealth 300 Win Mag. Any tips on what’s going on?


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Could be any number of things, from load specs, barrel condition to other shooter mechanics (like recoil management, rifle support like front and rear bag configuration). More details need to be known to have any idea what might be going on. Otherwise, the responses are nothing more than a shot in the dark. :rolleyes:
 

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Step 1: Don't exhale as you squeeze, squeeze after you exhale. You have a natural respiratory pause for several seconds after an exhale. Use it. Don't breathe deep. Just breathe.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Could be any number of things, from load specs, barrel condition to other shooter mechanics (like recoil management, rifle support like front and rear bag configuration). More details need to be known to have any idea what might be going on. Otherwise, the responses are nothing more than a shot in the dark. :rolleyes:
I use a bipod on a bench and a small sandbag under the butt. I use Remington and Federal ammo (Hornady wasn’t working for me). I have a telescopic stock in the back with a muzzle break in the front. Wind isn’t the issue. It’s me. I’m trying to learn how but nobody who really knows how to shoot goes to my range except for the range officers who work there who aren’t much help.


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I use a bipod on a bench and a small sandbag under the butt. I use Remington and Federal ammo (Hornady wasn’t working for me). I have a telescopic stock in the back with a muzzle break in the front. Wind isn’t the issue. It’s me. I’m trying to learn how but nobody who really knows how to shoot goes to my range except for the range officers who work there who aren’t much help.
You might find the article written on this website of some help (though having a lot to do with the prone position, a lot can be applied to shooting off a bench, and there other articles with info you may find of help too)

https://www.primalrights.com/library/articles/precision-rifle-marksmanship-zero-force-firing-position
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I’ve also noticed that my rifle shoots better when it’s not clean. Is that just a coincidence? I’ve read that link. Thanks


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Don't clean your bore just because you shot the gun. It will shoot more consistently when dirty, up to a point. When it gets to that point, then clean.

My match rifles might get thoroughly cleaned 1 time over the entire life of the barrel.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Don't clean your bore just because you shot the gun. It will shoot more consistently when dirty, up to a point. When it gets to that point, then clean.

My match rifles might get thoroughly cleaned 1 time over the entire life of the barrel.
Thanks for the tip. That’s what the guy who assembled it for me said. I thought he was nuts. I’ll let it ride dirty for a while. I’ll keep the outside clean from rust and stuff though. Yes?


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Dirty barrel/clean barrel, breathing, position behind rifle, ammo will all make a difference. However usually not 3 moa difference. If you are shooting 1 moa and want to shoot 1/2 moa then these things will usually get you there if the rifle is capable.

I bet that at 3 moa there is a significant problem or a stack of small problems...not any one small thing.

Do you know for certain that your rifle is capable of better than 3 moa? Is the scope trashed? Have you tried a different scope? All screws tight? Action screws, scope base screws, ring screws? Is the barrel floating?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Dirty barrel/clean barrel, breathing, position behind rifle, ammo will all make a difference. However usually not 3 moa difference. If you are shooting 1 moa and want to shoot 1/2 moa then these things will usually get you there if the rifle is capable.

I bet that at 3 moa there is a significant problem or a stack of small problems...not any one small thing.

Do you know for certain that your rifle is capable of better than 3 moa? Is the scope trashed? Have you tried a different scope? All screws tight? Action screws, scope base screws, ring screws? Is the barrel floating?
Actually it was shooting like this one time a bunch of weeks back and it turned out the barrel was coming loose. The gunsmith said he fixed it, but to check it every now and then. The scope is brand new. I have a feeling it’s time to have it checked out again.


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If the barrel is coming loose and a smith checked it out then you need a new Smith. There is no reason for a barrel to ever work loose when installed properly.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Haha. Hopefully it’s not the gun. I’ll get it right. It’s just that it looks to me like the reticle is in place when the gun goes off. Not sure why I think that. It’s obvious I’m doing something wrong.


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I had a Leupold scope give out on me a couple years ago. It wouldn’t stay on paper at 50 yards. It wouldn’t surprise me if the recoil from that magnum rifle trashed the scope.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I had a Leupold scope give out on me a couple years ago. It wouldn’t stay on paper at 50 yards. It wouldn’t surprise me if the recoil from that magnum rifle trashed the scope.
Oh man I hope not. It already trashed my Nikon Bushmaster II 4-12. Nikon replaced it, but you might be right.


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How can I check to see if it’s my scope?


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I would start out by letting someone you know is a seasoned shooter take a few shots at 100 and see their results, if they are similar to yours then I would swop out the scope and see what you can do with it at 25yds then 100. If you and the seasoned shooter still can't do better then, you might need to look at something else like torque specs on the action screws, scope base, scope rings. You can usually get ring torque specs from the scope manufacturers and the base specs from the base manufacturer. The Action screw torque specs may or may not be in the owners manual so you may have to contact your gun Manufacturer for that spec. I think they run around 18 inch lbs or so for rings holding my Vortex scopes but confirm with your mfg for you model scope. Realize that you can over torque scope rings and damage a scope. If you don't have a FAT Wrench yet, you may want to invest in one or something similar so that you are tightening everything to the proper specs in Inch Pounds instead of Foot Pounds.

I had a rem 700 SA base that had one screw get loose over time and after checking everything I finally took off the scope and tightened the screws on the scope base and my problem was solved. Some guys have used removable Loctite on base screws that are repeat offenders.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Ok so here’s what I did today. I went to a dealer and had their gunsmith look over the gun. He said aside from the scope being sighted a little bit off to the left, everything else was perfect. So I went back to the range. Set up targets at 50 100 150 and 200. Right away it was dead on perfect when I stepped up from target to target. But then I just couldn’t keep them consistent at 200. Went back to 50 and started again. It was good. Then again I couldn’t keep it consistent. Does the trajectory change that much with a hot barrel?
 

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My 2 bits (of what works for me):
How much does it kick? Someone on a previous post suggested a brake...I couldn’t agree more. You have to be able to pull the trigger and keep your eyes open at the same time you hear the bang. A slight flinch, and you’re off, even at 200 yds.
The gun getting hot shouldn’t make much difference (unless the barrel is sizzling hot).
Consider taking a break every so many rds. Don’t keep pulling the trigger just because the previous round was too far off. Give your eyes and your head a rest.
Does the rifle fit you well?
Someone else also said shoot from a prone position...yup, do that, too. Get yourself a comfortable mat.
Use a good tripod. I started with an Atlas, but it was not steady enough. I changed to an M2 Springfield bipod (M14 bipod).
How much do you zoom in with your scope?
A co worker used to shoot a .303 Enfield with iron sights at targets @300 mts. He did very well in quite a few competitions. At 200 mts, you should be able to get decent groups with no more than 4X magnification. You’ll feel that you’re aim is steadier, than with greater magnification.

It took me quite a few rds and several weekends at the range to get to know my rifle and get it to feel comfortable: the heavier the rifle, the better (you’re not gonna hunt with it, so weight it not an issue. I went as far as putting a recoil reducer inside the stock buffer tube, together with the brake and a heavy barrel, it feels like a .223. (It’s a 338 LM). Overall, it weighs 20 lbs.
Now, to me, PRS has become an expensive obsession, so don’t go overboard! It takes time, and sometimes, you still shoot like hell.

Soon enough, you’ll start reloading you’re own match ammo!

(Again, my 2 cents).


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Actually it was shooting like this one time a bunch of weeks back and it turned out the barrel was coming loose. The gunsmith said he fixed it, but to check it every now and then. The scope is brand new. I have a feeling it’s time to have it checked out again.


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YIKES! One of the reasons to become your own smith...just like packing your own parachute!


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