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Discussion Starter #1
According to a report by the Pentagon torso hits account to only 9% of total hits by rifle fire in combat, so that means that extremities and limbs account for 91%

think about a 155grain .45 ACP SWC fired from a necked up .308 winchester case at 2300FPS

It would be quite nasty if it hits any limb :)
 

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It would do some damage alright...How about 50 Beowulf though?
 

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Some specialized units in the DEA use the .50 BEOWULF allready... the 5.56 rounds wernt putting down people fast enough who were hopped up on drugs (PCP especially). It uses a standard AR-15 magazine with slightly modified lips in a single stack configuration. 30 round 5.56 mags hold 15 rounds of .50 Beowulf... 40 round mags hold 20 rounds of the Beowulf ammo... ect ect. Not sure if any one is making drums for them yet. Ive seen a custom made MK-48 SF SAW converted from 7.62X51mm to .50 Beowulf... it worked quite well. Only problem with that is you have to use modified .50BMG links and they are hard to reliably modify. Ive also seen an M-249 SPW converted to 10mm... thats right the pistol caliber. :) It worked good as well... but im not sure i would want to use it in a combat situation.

BC
 

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BC, do you know if it's illegal to own the 50 Beowulff (sic) in CA, or just the AR lower? I ain't sure if the ban banned all .50 caliber rifle rounds, or just .50 BMG.

Scatch Maroo
 

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Its just the .50BMG... and you can make a california legal AR-15. They have non detachable (internal) 10 round mags. Thats the only difference from a real AR. Its called the FAB-10. www.fabten.com My 1,000 yard iron sight AR-15 is built off of the FAB-10 lower reciever.

BC
 

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Here is a better link with pics to show you how it works. http://www.fabten.com/build_it.htm

The cool thing about the FAB Ten lower reciever is that it exempts the rifle you build up on it from the "assault" weapon list... so you can put a 6 position military collapsable stock on it... a foregrip... a flash supressor... and a bayonet lug and its still legal. The ONLY thing that is different from the FAB Ten and a real AR-15 is that the magazine is not removable. You reload it with a 10 round stripper clip.

BC
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I checked on the .50 Beowulf,

Well it's a great concept and a very sound one, but what I'm proposing is a bit more effective :wink:

G3K coud employ 19 rd magazines as the base diameter of .45 ACP and .308 Winchester is almost identical, so u would have an automatic weapon firing SWC 155 .45 ACP bullets to saturate any room with big caliber lead in less than two seconds
 

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Heres my problem with that, Accuracy. Due to the velocity placed on such a small bullet, I have a real feeling that that round wont shoot worth ****.

Just an opinion though, if you load a round for me I can get a barrel made for you to place on a contender frame though, for preliminary round testing.
 

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I think spade is right... a light... some what flat ... large caliber bullet traveling at high velocity would not be accurate at all. It would more than likely tumble quite wildly... and the .50 Beowulf is a proven caliber as it is in use with several Government agencies and civilian shooters alike.


This is a .458 SOCOM... my friend has an identical one in .50 Beowulf

BC
 

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Oh baby...

Scatch Maroo
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Firearms expert Gabe Suarez stated that most CQB occurs within an envelope of 50 yards

so it doesn't have to be very accurate besides 155 grain isn't a light bullet
 

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Well step up to the plate man, want an FAL made for it? Or an FAL barrel? I've heard 3-4 of these poppycock idea's of yours. I wanna see you try one.

Contact me if your ready for inital testing.
 

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FMJ ammo is a different beast, I know, but with things like TAP and the fact if its at home you can use what you wish, well as a hunter I have seen some 308 caliber rounds with around 2700 fps of scoot hit things in limbs. The result is a shattered limb thats unusable. For combat with a rifle at 50 yards, I think just about anything used by real militaries is perfectly up to the task. AK, M16, whatever else really. we're not blobs of gelatin and in the real world when FMJ rounds like .223 or 7.62x39mm hit our bones some very bad things happen.

I'll keep the 308 in the 308 and the 45 acp in the pistola. Creativity and ideas are good man, but you're reinventing the wheel and kinda fixin whats never been broken. For short range rifle combat, a 30 30 lever gun is not a half bad idea either, as a civvie. The trouble is, hitting people in the limbs is a symptom. The disease is not being able to hit people in the torso, where that bullets needed.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Actually I was thinking of a mix of cartridges,

Some assault rifles would be fit for necked down .223/.308 to penetrate body armour and some carabines to maximize damage using .45/.308 so that the enemy is not merly wounded, he actively loses a limb or get an AP round in the torso
 
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