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Pistols (Round 2)

14730 Views 28 Replies 11 Participants Last post by  Kamatz
Now that I got a formal apology for everyone screwing up my other post, (just kidding guys :wink: ) I have decided to start another.

Well I have done some more looking around and have narrowed my choices down; although there is still quite a bit more research to do...

Here is what I have looked at and liked ( but most i have never shot besides the Walther P99 and it was only briefly)

Browning Hi-Power
Walther P99
H&K USP Series
Several different Glock models
Colt 1911 or a copy thereof
Sig Pro Series or a member of the Sig P22x Family (ie 226, 229, 228 etc.)


A gold plated .50AE Desert Eagle!!!

Please dont tell me to go try different ones out and pick which fits best for me. I am in no hurry to buy one since I can't even buy a handgun for another 10 or 11 months anyways. I want to hear why you would pick one over all the others and also include what caliber you would get it in. And please dont turn this into a debate of 9mm vs. .45 ACP because I could see that happening (again :) ) Also I especially want to know abou the Browning Hi-Power since i know the least about it so if you have any expierience with it please share it. Oh and just kidding with that Desert Eagle by the way :D

PS - For some reason the Berreta 92 series doesnt really appeal to me for some reason but if you can give a strong argument for it I would still love to hear it. And please not outrageous suggestion such as a Mk. 23; the purpose of my gun when I buy it will be mainly for target shooting with the possibility of carrying it (I haven't decided if I want to or not, but I want to keep the option open)

Lets try to stay on topic this time. I am pretty new to handgun shooting and don't know much but am eager to learn.
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I'm having ..or had, maybe..the same problems. I'm not quite sure what to buy. And I can't buy it for some months to come...most likely.

My gun will have to be included on the IPSC Production list, so, unfortunatly, for my part the Hi Power is out - and the BDA9 is in. Sadly. Because there is no other I'd rather have than the HP MK4S.

Anyways, John Browning designed the HP to "correct" minor "fault" on the 1911. Some say he did a good job, others are too fanatical about their 1911 to even look twice on the HP :wink: Calibers set aside, I'd rather have a HP (or BDA9...) than a 1911. Size n' shape are the reasons for that.

I'm also considering the SIG P226-AL-SO with a threaded barrel. It's a tad on the expensive side, but what the heck, the police wont let me buy many more those I buy might as well be something special. Everyone knows that all the big boys are using SIGs..and few have anything negative to say about them. Although, Sweden did swap their SIGs for Glocks (wasn't it) after the SIGs had worn out after 7-8000 rounds. If you really can't expect to have a SIG surviving more than 8000 rounds - well, if that's true I'm going back to a FN BDA9.

Glock is for me one of the best choices for a carry weapon. In my days as a military guard commander I carried a G17. Its light weight, big magazine and simple operation are important aspects in my eyes for a carry weapon. But, for my situation, in a country where we aren't allowed to carry weapons, it's too dull to bring to the range for some happy plinking. Granted, apart from the MP-446 Viking winning this year, a Glock is usually found on the top of the lists in the Production class...they are good.

I haven't had much experience with the USP series. What I can say is that I really didn't like the USP9 Compact. And I don't like the standard I'd be left with the Tactical or Tac9. Now after a year of Mk23 shooting I guess I should tinker with a USP again to see if my opinion has changed.

The best thing you could do is find a pistol range with plenty of people and weapons - and start talking with people about their weapons. You'll learn a lot of first hand experience, and most likely they'll let you squeeze of a few rounds. That's better than anyone here can do for you over the forum.
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Please dont tell me to go try different ones out and pick which fits best for me.
I would tell you, since that is the best advice, but I will refrain. Of course, 'fitting you' also entails caliber, feature accessiblity, etc.

Sig 220 Langdon is going to be my next purchase. I like it. And since I like it, and it is extremly accurate, it is a winner.

Any weapon on your list, except the DE .50 is a good weapon. Glocks and Sigs are pretty cheap if you get a good dealer who won't screw you. ALong with basic 1911's.

the purpose of my gun when I buy it will be mainly for target shooting
Just like rifles - you get what you pay for. There are so many options, it would take a week for me to list them all, you could go custom all the way from, STI, Kimber, Sig just to name a few, and have a very unique weapon. Or you can buy a kimber, and upgrade the parts, from palces like STI, Kimber custom, or any other high quality 1911 part dealer.

Buy yourself some gun mags. and look at the advertiser index, and goto thier websites, see what they offer, read reviews on the net. Be INFORMED about your decision.
Being informed is exactly why I made this thread.

The reason I did not want to hear "try different ones and pick what is best for me" is because right now I don't really have the option to do that right now. The only close gun range around here does not rent out any sort of firearms. I have shot a friends Walther P99 and I may get the chance to fire a friend of a friends 9mm SIG (dont know what model) but other than that, the only expierience I may have in a gun is handling it at the gun store and deciding based on what I have read and what I have been told. So what i was hoping for was to get responses from people who have owned and use some of these guns and tell me their strengths or weaknesses.

As I said before I am pretty new to handgun shooting and it is hard to find strength and weaknesses of weapons just by looking at manufacturers websites since they only give the stats (plus I think they might be a little biased about their own gun :) and pointing out weaknesses of your own product is probably not a very good marketing strategy)
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have you had a chance to test the Viking? if so how does it shoot/feel?
Id say the FN FiveseveN if over penitration isnt much of a problem ( id say a backup or secondary). other then that i would say a kimber .45 1911 copy (very reliable and customisable). All i have to say about the gold plated .50 Desert Eagle is they dont seem very practical to me, a little bulky, but then again they do make .40 version and conversion kits.
I think you need to decide if you want to go single action, double action, or single and double action. That choice will decide for you, at least in part, what brand you end up with.

I prefer single action only (you carry it cocked and locked), like a 1911, but you can also find them chambered in 9mm, 10mm, or .40 cal. My single action has a sweet short match trigger - 3.5 pounds - crisp, with no creep or overtravel (it reminds me of a rifle trigger).

I hate the standard double action loooooong trigger - tons of travel until you hit the sear release point, then overtravel until you finally stop. Then again that may only have been the specific glocks (19 and 23), and beretta (96) that I was shooting at the range during that time period.

Sorry Max, I wish I had :wink: I only know a guy who was watching the ex-Spetsnaz guy win the Production this summer, I think it was. It's interesting. Even more so because I'd probably be the only one in Norway with a MP-446 :mrgreen: But, Russian smallarms are rumoured to have a short lifespan - and that's a mood killer.

I'll be sure to let people know if I end up buying a Viking :wink:

The trigger on Glocks is neither single or double action. And that's why it has a very loooong travel to begin with. It's a habit. Pulling in the travel and keeping the trigger right at the sear release point is something you get used to. Most people do, anyway...

I know that NO safety in the world would convince me to carry a weapon cocked and locked. I can do that with a Glock - but that's because I know there's no way it'll discharge without me pulling the trigger. A 1911, as an example, can if you, one way or the other, disengage the safety. But I guess this is something you get used to and comfortable with, too....
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I've heard of 1911s going off when they were either 1) taken off safety and someone pulled the trigger by accident or 2) dropped it when cocked and locked.

The first is a question of training and the second a quesiton of the quality, care and maintenance of a firearm (i.e. the grip safety actually functions as it was intended).

I've personally never seen one or had one go off in my presence under those situations. Given the 3 different safeties (all of which function) on my Kimber Series II, I cannot concieve of having an accidental discharge under the circumstaces you describe.

As to cocked and locked, a 1911 is not much good as a carry firearm (whether or not concealed) if you need to first either crank back the hammer or pull the slide back in anticipation of firing the first shot. Then again, some people do it that way.
Russian smallarms are some of the most durable weapons ever produced especially there military/police Makarov. I however would choose a polish makarov because well im polish.

What about single action pistols such as the Browning HP, which have a half-cock position?
I've heard more than one owner of Russian smallarms complaining about short lifespans. I know one guy with an original PM which is all but falling apart now - after just over 6000 rounds. That's not a whole lot.

Newer pistols from Izmach aren't exactly typical 30 000+ round weapons, either as far as I've heard.
Madison said:
Russian smallarms are some of the most durable weapons ever produced especially there military/police Makarov. I however would choose a polish makarov because well im polish.
Maybe SOME of them are durable. However, let me tell you - ours (Russians, as i am Russian) Makarov is just a bad copy of Walther P38. Some of my countryfolks (especially fiercely patriotic ones) gonna object that, but that's true. It is mediocre pistol overall. It is chambered for 9x18, which is almost equal to .380, and about 50% weaker than standart-charged 9mm Para. It holds 8 rounds. Speed reloading is a pain. The only reason our police (and some of the military) stick with it is that we just dont have another widely produced combat pistol. Of course, some happy guys carry 9x21 SR1, or APS at least, but thats hardly the case. I myself know military snipers who carry 2 Makarovs as a backup, just because they dont have any alternative :-(
have u had an opportunity to test the MP443? if so how does it shoot?
Max338: Now, unfortunately. There are rumors that Grach is already in service, but i doubt it will be used widespread until 2006 or so.
from what i heard... (Val Shilins website LoL) the Grach is a good service pistol... just... a lil on the heavy side being entirely steel and all....
You are treading seriously close to "over-thinking" your choice of pistol. The ones you listed are all good pistols which would certainly meet your needs. JUST PICK ONE AND BUY IT! No matter what your choice, you will probably discover something that you do not like/prefer/hate about it...most importantly you will learn more about what you want in a pistol than you ever could have from reviews/other people/gun store. You can always trade-up later. Again, buy it and shoot it and have fun. Why do you think most of us own more than one gun?

Well thats a great plan truewarrior except i dont have the money to buy more than one gun. Nor do i want to buy something and find a flaw that i dont like. The purpose of this thread was to try to find people who have owned one of the pistols I listed and try to find out what problems they had with them or really liked about them. Unfortunately it has not happened yet. Purchasing a pistol is a huge investment since most good quality ones will cost around $600 or more. So i dont not just want to rush in a buy the first one i see. I want to do my research and make the right choice the first time.
You can get a glock 23 for under 500. Just to have "a pistol" that will do the job. But if you want to compete, have extreme accuracy, etc. Your talking a whole new ballpark of figures.
I was not recommending that you recklessly spend hundreds of dollars. On the contrary, it seems to me that you have extensively researched the pistols on your short list. Anyhow, I own a Kimber Pro CDP II (1911-style) and can provide specific information on my likes/ dislikes/ experience with it. I can also provide opinion on calibers .357, .40 s&w, and .45 ACP. Email me for the details. If you live in or near my location, let's go to the range and you can shoot any of the firearms I bring the ammo. You may also want to start separate forum topics with a poll for each of the pistols you are considering. The poll could ask the visitors to rate the pistol on each of several catagories ( ergonomics, concealability, function, etc.). Here to help!

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