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I have a quick question about ammo. I just bought an LTR and have a place to shoot it but no ammo. I have been looking around and found some Portuguese ammo thats $80 for 400rnds. I basically want to know if this is ok to break in the gun with and for general shooting or should I go with the Lake City ammo which is a little more expensive? Are there problems with ammo manufactured in other countries other than its not terribly accurate?
 

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+1 on everything Recoil said.

You won't see much accuracy out of it, but it will give you something to shoot when the budget is tight. With any surplus ammo, clean often.
 

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Portuguese military ammo is actually quite good. I used to shoot their 8mm and .223 ammo and the stuff was good blasting ammo.

But I'm puzzled. I don't understand how folks would go out and buy/build a LTR and then shoot cheap ammo through it. But then there are others who would fuel a Ferrari with kerosene.

Start handloading and don't look back. Buy yourself a keg of IMR-4064 and start loading.

Mad.
 

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Well, if someone is a good shooter with cheap ammo, I have more respect for them than if they must use handloads or superb match ammo such as Lapua to achieve the same results.

It's a good practice to shoot with the cheaper ammo, to heighten your own skill.
 

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I'm not very skilled so I respect anyone who can shoot.

But why use cheap ammo in an expensive rifle? Each shot wears the barrel just a little bit and barrel life is a finite thing.

I'm not finding fault with anyone, I was just a little puzzled. Shoot whatever you want, it is still a free country.

As for me, I have to go out and buy some 94 Octane fuel for my 7.7 liter V8. But then again, I'm

Mad.
 

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And barrel life can be cut even more short using handloads and match ammo, since quite a few choose to load fairly heavy, or buy heavy match loads with a bit more oomf.

And, I gave you the reasons why.
I'd rather spend a hell of a lot of time shooting, than a hell of a lot of time handloading and get less time for shooting. Guess which builds better shooting skills? :twisted:
 

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Shooting precision handloads. Why? Because it builds confidence when one shoots a precise cartridge. I don't overload ammo and that's precisely why I use handloads. I don't want loads that are too much for my rifle.

(And only idiots load over-pressure ammo. I might be mad, but I'm not an idiot)

Anyway, I dont want to argue with you. Shoot whatever you like. Shoot rusty steel cased ammo, if you enjoy a challenge. Just shoot whatever you want.



Mad.
 

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portugese 308

well shooting any round wears the barrel whether it is Fed GM, LC118SB or rem/win hunting or handloads, best reason I know for using Surplus ammo is to shoot and as far as reloading not everyone can or even wants to reload ,and getting to shoot 400rds for $ 80.00 is better practice than 60 rounds for about 90.00 Fed GM 168 in my world is just shy of $30.00 per box(20) and yes I shoot more surplus through my precision rifles than match grade and I do reload as well .I know I know Get off the soap box not my thread but just my thoughts sorry Mad meaning no disrespect but most surplus aint that bad had some surplus Egyptian 8mm heavy ball that would shoot .5 to .75 in a Mauser and have seen groups fired with argentine surplus at 200 yds that would equal Fed Gm 168 in .308.. but rusty steel case?
 

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Mad just means we can all choose to shoot whatever we like is all.

I see both sides of the discussion actually. If we let it end here that would be cool. Mad and Nek are speaking from opposite sides of a coin, but they both make a lot of sense.
 

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The trouble with any surplus ammo is that it comes in two grades:

1. Very good and

2. Very bad.

A number of years ago, I fired some Czech surplus ammo in my Walther P-38. This ammo actually sent my extractor flying. But being slow to learn, I then tried Bulgarian surplus ammo in my Lahti-L35. That caused big problems too. Part of a case rim got jammed into the sear and the gun was jammed open and totally unusable.

I tried Yugoslav ammo in my Lee Enfield and that stuff was pretty good. As corrosive as sin, but I was careful to clean the gun using boiling water.

And modern factory ammo is not always the greatest either. I have a Sako 6.5x55mm that will shoot only 3MOA with Remington or Winchester factory ammo. Yet this same rifle is a consistant sub MOA performer with handloads. I would never dream of firing factory ammo in that gun.


Mad
 

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Well, there is factory ammo that is stellar, such as Lapua or Norma. And Lapua's 6.5x55 really has the edge there. For my PSG90, when I don't fire mil-standard 7.62x51 FMJ/AP or the sub-caliber rounds, I use Lapua's Lockbase FMJ and their HPS+ ammo. Less bothersome than reloading, and I shoot better with it than with handloads.

I actually think there's some psychology in it all: In the beginning, I used to believe that no factory load could match a good handload, but when I gave it a chance, I realized that things must have changed in the last 40 years or so.
 

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I agree that both Lapua and Norma load superb ammunition.

But loaded ammo from these firms is fiendishly expensive in North America. The only way to affordably achieve Lapua and Norma levels of accuracy is to carefully load ammo by hand.

But notice that this thread began as a discussion regarding the use of cheap surplus ammo. Lapua and Norma ammo does not fall into this category.

Every Lapua or Norma round is a beautiful, polished jewel. And an expensive, match rifle deserves such ammo. ( or carefully loaded handloads.)


Mad.
 

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Probably the best Surplus ammo I have ever shot was the Danish AMA headstamp ammo in 30-06 the 91 lot was sub MOA in a garand, and in a 700 that a buddy fired it in. The ammo was very clean, and I wish I could find more alas it went fast, so no more is to be found. The 60 lot I still have very few of, and it shoots about 1,25 MOA in my garand so for ball surplus it pretty good, but is very hotly loaded, kicks like a mule.
 

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Some cartridges you just have to handload for...6.5x55 and 8mm Mauser included. Winchester and Remington can make some great ammo...when they want to. My favorite factory ammo has always been Federal though.
 

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Another great lot of surplus ammo was a 1978 lot of 7.65x53mm Mauser made in Belgium by Fabrique National.

Another great lot was a 1976 lot of Swedish 6.5x55mm loaded by Norma. It was excellent, but the primers were a little hard for my Sako. In the Swedish Mauser it was excellent.

Mad.
 
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