Quiet Operation ... Take 3 ... M1 vs. AR

8488 Views 22 Replies 9 Participants Last post by Ballistic_Coefficiency, Feb 10, 2005

Xover320

Discussion Starter · Jan 24, 2005

To everyone ..... thanks for your excellent information. Question, how would you rate the M1A1/M25 against an AR equivalent? Can the Springfield use subsonic ammo? The say the M1 is the best semiauto ever built .... what do you think? Pros/cons?

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

6.5shooter

· #2 · Jan 24, 2005

I read an article where they placed a supressed AR-15 head to head with a supressed mini-14 (i know its not an m1, but same design). The results were pretty astounding to me, the mini-14 was far louder than the AR. If i remember correctly the author stated that the design of the mini-14 action caused not only a lot of mechanical sound, but the supressor didnt help near like it did on the AR. Sorry i cant go into more detail on why it was louder, but i cant find that magazine to save my life. My $.02
Chris

Jeff_850

· #3 · Jan 24, 2005

AR-15 isnt as loud as an M1 Garand
the AR uses .223 Rem while the M1 uses .30-06
just get an AR-15 with a threaded barrel so you can use supressors if there legal or atleast no muzzle brake

also with an AR-15 your good if 29 other losers try to jump you after you get rid of your pesk

westpointranger

· #4 · Jan 24, 2005

Gotta agree with Jeff850. The AR15 is without doubt the ultimate do-everything rifle.

Scatch Maroo

· #5 · Jan 24, 2005

westpointranger said:
Gotta agree with Jeff850. The AR15 is without doubt the ultimate do-everything rifle.

Except function properly...

Sorry, I've had a grudge against it since I used the first versions in 'Nam.

Scatch "You All Know I'm Full of Stuff" Maroo

Jeff_850

· #6 · Jan 24, 2005

umm Scatch...
the AR-15 DOES function properly now
the ones in NAM didnt function properly because cleaning kits wernt issued, cheap gunpower was used, it was already in a bad area for a rifle to be in
now then, IF cleaning kits were issued, less crappy powders would be used etc
the M-16 wouldnt have jammed nearly as often as it did in NAM
take care of the M-16 it wont let you down

westpointranger

· #7 · Jan 24, 2005

Sorry Scatch, not true. The original M16s were crap. But it's been 40 years since then and the M16-series has come a long way. The M16A2/A4 is one of the most reliable rifles in service.

muzzleblast

· #8 · Jan 25, 2005

Still nearly the fussiest of semi-autos though, right? Same thing makes it the most accurate, really?

westpointranger

· #9 · Jan 25, 2005

Still nearly the fussiest of semi-autos though, right? Same thing makes it the most accurate, really?

How do you mean :? ?

Jeff_850

· #10 · Jan 25, 2005

what do you mean?

Kaz

· #11 · Jan 25, 2005

I think the reliability issues with the AR15/M16A...whatever has been pretty much solved hasn't it? I've seen 'em get pretty nasty and still function. Anywho, the AR will be quieter because the system isn't as "open" if you know what I mean. A gas port is sort of like another muzzle, hot gasses come rocketing out of there as well and more of it in the case of the M1. It's not contained as much I guess. Is this seeming familiar 6.5shooter? Also, since the M1 has more moving parts there will be the aforementioned mechanical noise too. Getting back to reliability, the gas system is one big reason the M1 has a reliability advantage over the AR; the AR vents it all back into the action and fire control group, where you need it the least. Proper maintenence and good powder should prevent problems though. Still, it's no Kalashnikov... 8) Will an M14/M1A work with subsonic? Not sure, don't really see why not. Also, Muzzleblast, did you mean that bit about being fussy and accurate are related because of tighter tolerances?

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muzzleblast

· #12 · Jan 25, 2005

Yeah, Kaz, I did mean the tighter tolerances, didn't think I'd have to simplify much

Scatch Maroo

· #13 · Jan 25, 2005

Scatch Maroo said:
Sorry, I've had a grudge against it since I used the first versions in 'Nam.

Scatch "You All Know I'm Full of Stuff" Maroo

I wasn't in 'Nam, as my post alleges, and the nick name inserted in my tag, I would hope, would divulge the intent of my post...

6.5shooter

· #14 · Jan 25, 2005

Kaz,
Your explination comes close to what was said in the magazine, the author added something else to the argument yet i cant remember what it was. Thanks for filling in the blank spot in my memory.
Chris

Hectorvictorious

· #15 · Jan 25, 2005

Between the two, doesn't the AR have more potential accuracy? The barrel being able to be completely free floated and all.

Jeff_850

· #16 · Jan 25, 2005

yea the AR-15 is probably going to have the most accuracy potential
a good match model's accuracy should be on par with higher end custom guns at 100y

westpointranger

· #17 · Jan 25, 2005

yea the AR-15 is probably going to have the most accuracy potential
a good match model's accuracy should be on par with higher end custom guns at 100y

Dang straight. Just show 'em a pic of your Varminter 8) .

Jeff_850

· #18 · Jan 26, 2005

its somewhere in my gallery
MOST accurized AR-15s will shoot sub 1/2" @ 100y with match/varmint ammo, some with even FMJ ammo

Xover320

Discussion Starter · #19 · Jan 26, 2005

Excellent info ........ you are giving me a lot to consider. So I gotta ask ..... is there a subsonic round that willl work effectively in a AR .308 receiver? Got a call from Springfield today and they said that sobsomic ammo will not work in their semiautos. Any thoughts?

Ballistic_Coefficiency

· #20 · Feb 10, 2005

westpointranger said:
Sorry Scatch, not true. The original M16s were crap. But it's been 40 years since then and the M16-series has come a long way. The M16A2/A4 is one of the most reliable rifles in service.

I dont know how old this post is... but ill reply anyway. I dont know if your talking shooting range reliable or combat reliable... but ive had my ass in the sand long enough to have totally destroyed 3 rifles. Did i mention they were all AR-15 style rifles? 2 of them were standard M-4A1's with your ussual optics and lights n stuff... the other was an M-16A2 with a M-203... on the M-4's... i had a bullet go flyin out the left side of the barrel where the handguard is (maybe this is a sign from the barrel gods to make the damn barrel under the shroud the same diameter as the barrel outside the shroud... but what the hell do i know?) ... and the other one i had it pull a rim then slam fire an M-855 SS109 round and the SS209 came flyin out the right side of the barrel extension. The M-16A2 we were screwin around with at the MK-84 range (tactical combat range) at camp pendleton... i fired a 3 round burst 4 times then on the 5th burst i had the sear break in half... wonderful. So i put the thing on semi auto and racked back the charging handle... when i did that i notice there was a huge gouge out of the side of the bolt... when i looked more clearly it had a peice of brass stuck in it.. when i checked the chamber i saw an exploded M-193 round embedded into the chamber. NOT EXACTLY RELIABLE :lol:

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