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snipier simulator??

7843 Views 13 Replies 6 Participants Last post by  mele, 
J
Mel:
i looked at your 2004 goals page, im interested
want to go into some more detail?
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S
That was probably on his new years resolutions to learn to program. :D

Who knows? I've had a website template in .PSD form I made for SC.com a while back when I was still doing web work, he is welcome to that as well... I digress.

It would be fairly easy to make one with no graphics, well, not good ones anyway. I've seen some pretty bad "Sniper" games though. To make the simulation, you would first need to create a "world."

The world would have to have settings for, wind, heat, humidiy, view distance, mirage, sun angle, etc. etc.

Thats not including all of the ballistics yet. It wouldn't be the easiest of tasks. You cant really accurately simulate breathing control or trigger pull either, unless you tie the game into a controller of some sorts. Everyone is different in precise technique.
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J
Sub hit the nail on the head. Even if you can control for altitude, heat and humidity, its the variable fluid dynamics of the wind, and your breathing control and tigger squeeze that make the real shot. If there was a simulator game where the control stick was a dummy rifle, with a real trigger and your breathing came into play - that would be hard as hell and truly realistic.

I've seen and played with the demos for the Long Range Shooting Simulator (to help you train on Mil Dot Ranging). Boring after about 3 minutes. The wind is constant, notwithstanding its speed (like that really happens at any time in Houston Texas). It simply becomes a math quiz. Once the math is solved, you can put as many shots as you want into incredibly tight groups (like the same hole) at huge distances. As much as I'd like to blow sunshine in your ear about sniper skills and all that, its not exactly real life.
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M
Ah, come on guys, your not even giving me a chance!!

Reality is, as plain as the web site is, I really do have programming experience. :D

The simulator is planned to be a true 3D world "attempting" to simulate sniping operations as close as possible. Now, the undertaking is huge, but the plan is to go about it slowly and steady. With a long development cycle, but lower featured releases consistently being released. Work is already in progress, but will not get going full speed until about july. The goal is a playable one mission demo with LIMITED features by early next year. It will be first person.

Now, I fully understand the difficulties modeling ballistics, wind, mirage, etc. But, many people thought modeling fluid dynamics in a flight simulator was a nightmare also, but then a guy did it with X-Plane, and has a very loyal following. I hope to achieve the same. There is no way to make a perfect simulator, as I'm not going to get into hardware and have a rifle control stick built. But it can model reading mirage, using mil-dots, hitting moving and unpredictiable targets, model ballistics to include changing weather conditions, all very valuable things, and the same time, be fun. None of the FPS games out there even remotely come close to modeling how it really is. I am going to give it a whirl, and I have some resources I can tap here also to help out. Plan is to always have a free 1 level demo, with full version for $10.

MEL
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J
Mel

Let us know when your demo/beta version is ready. I have force feedback joystick ready to rock and roll.

Better yet you need to go with a vibration induced firing recognition system like they use on BeamHit (they use it to fire a pulse laser onto a target sitting across the room to practice firing rifle and pistol). In your case you would use the sensor on a rifle (I could use my own rifle and trigger) to fire the game bullet. VERY NEAT!

Speaking of Beamhit have you ever tried it. I have one, and my pistol scores have gone through the roof (maybe a procduct of practice, but there is a correlation in my using it any scores going up 30%). I have not yet used it in my .308, but the system is simple and it does not harm your firearms. The neat thing is you use your weapons and, therefore, your trigger.
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N
Yeah, I'm interested in this too. So far, only the Delta Force series have included a limited bullet drop(and as of DF3 and later, wind to a certain degree).

About X-Plane, his CFD calcs rely very much on caching the finished results and interpolating, but even then, it's impressive compared to the lookup table-based Flight Sim 2004.

Oh, and if you think the CFD is tricky, that's just from a purely computational perspective... The AI is going to be worse... Trust me...
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M
Nek:

Dont even get started on Delta Force... ive played all of them accept the Black Hawk Down version. 1 is ok, 2 is better, 3 is starting to get good, but for sniper inthusiasts.... Delta Force Task Force Dagger (afghanistan) is the best. i didnt wanna write a game review, but i will say that it includes: the M 24, AW L 96, M 40 A 3, and the XM 107 (M 82 a1).

as for anyone else....
The US military (army to be specific) has developed a game called America's Army. this is a free game that is given to prospecting recruits. anyway is Perfectly simulates the breathing and trigger pull variables. in this game you have to go through all the steps in order to graduate from basic. there is a Designated Marksman course, where u can familiarize and qualify with both the M 24 and M 82. (Mel u might have done something similar) anyway is simulates the breathing and trigger pull and recoil variables, and to some extent wind and bullet drop (i guess graphics suck on my comp)..
Max
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Max338:

Ugh, DF:TFD and DF:BHD sucks badly, both of them. The variety of rifles in TFD is the only thing that kinda makes up for it. They reduced the wind factor in TFD, because too many whined about it being so influential in DF3.

As for America's Army, only the breathing _really_ matters when you're playing the actual missions, because the range is so short. Just like in so many other games, reaction and low ping is far more important.
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M
Ah, now you guys are starting to get it. The general mass market will not like my sim, it'll be too realistic, and they won't be able to laser shoot their buddy 1500 meters away. BUT, there are a few of us out there that are interested in ballistics/wind/ etc being modeled accurately, where it becomes a REAL treat to register a hit at 750 meters in high winds shooting from an elevated position with the first shot.

Did I mention it will be multiplayer, cooperative or adversarial. With a snipercentral server for "official" ranking, or you can host your own server, etc.

AI, yeah, I know, it will in fact be a pain to make it worthwhile. Luckily there are some libs out there to help give a boost start to it.

MEL
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N
Mel:

Hmmm, is there any way you can step up production? ;)

Oh, and can I get a special account where I get a PSG90 and our sabot round? ;)

Btw, about the AI, which libs are you planning to use?
Oh, and there's some useful stuff on this website, if you didn't already know about it: http://www.gameai.com/
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M
Nek,

Thanks for the link, I had been there a few times before. No decision on the AI libs yet, I'm hoping some of the "projects" get a bit more solidified before I'm in need. If not, thats okay.

Yes, at some point (okay, not initial release, but later) your PSG-90 will in fact be modeled with your sabot rounds. Initial release will be one, maybe two rifles with standard M118 (LR?) modeled. The plan is to do as XPlane has and just keep continuing development for years.

I plan to step up production in June in a major way! (finishing up some programming jobs... and not taking any more so I can focus on sc.com and snipersim)

I also have a few other programmers that want to contribute, and that should really help speed things up. More data to come.

MEL
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S
If you need models, lemme know. I'd perfer not to texture them, but I could do that as well.

I'll post some screenshots of my work when I find the right CD! :D
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N
Mel:

Well, if it hadn't been for me being so damned busy(the earliest weeks of hyperactive posting here being a fluke), I'd offer to help out too.
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M
Thanks guys! The more help, the faster it'll get completed, and the better it will be. Models would be extremely helpful....

MEL
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