I was drooling over these, but I couldn't get myself to fork over nearly a hundred bucks for a leveler, since I would then want one for each of my precision rifles.

I ended up going for the cheap B-Square units for about $20 each and they are well worth the $20. I have a picatinny rail on the top of my rifles and B-Square levelers for the Weaver style are great.

However, the B-Square is made of plastic, and requires an allen wrench to take it off or put it back on. I noticed at sub-freezing temperatures the liquid gets cloudy. However it is still functional and it only requires opening your non-shooting eye to ensure a level shot. The top mounted ones at Midway require you to lift your head and your rear Butler Creek will block them unless you flip it to 90 degrees.

I think the B-Square is a great alternative item for sighting in and developing a load at the range, but I think the U.S. Optics one would be better and much more durable if you are going to use it in the field. Unfortunately there aren't a lot of other alternatives to the U.S. Optics level that I have seen from a durability standpoint. Just my humble opinion since I don't yet own the U.S. Optics to give it a thorough evaluation.

As a side note I found that there are mixed reviews on the need for a bubble level amongst the shooting community. My bubble level has improved my accuracy and confidence. I didn't realize how much cant I get from shot to shot until I got mine. I got a .15" group at 100 yards the other day and my record before the bubble was .19". (I shoot mostly target, and besting my groups helps me with my load development). I realize that .05" will not make much difference on a tactical shot, but I have found that the effects out past 300 yards are much greater in my shooting when I can't check my cant (heh). Also in the field and under pressure, you may be more prone to shooting differently (at an un-noticed canted angle) than how you sighted at the range without one of these fine gizmos.

- sorry for the essay-

 

I have not seen those. They look like they would work great. I use a Wheeler Level Level Level but I will say that on some of my rifles it does not work. On my Savage 10fp for instance, there is no place to put it.

At nearly 100.00 though....I think I can make due for now without it.

I feel that you do need to get your scope level though to make accurate adjustments on the target.

 

However it is still functional and it only requires opening your non-shooting eye to ensure a level shot.

And me without a non-shooting eye....

 

In a word, No.

Rigger

 

Also looks like it would stick out from the rifle quite a bit. I hate having hang-ups when in the woods or when putting the rifle in and out of the case, might also break easy with it sticking out so far. I'd like to see one that mounts under the rear of the scope somehow so it's under the eyepiece. Don't ask me how they'd make it work though . . .

-matt

 

Thank you for the reply everyone ... I can see how it would improve accuracy. If you click the link and read the description it mentions something about it folding 90 degrees when not needed. From the picture I cant really tell where it would fold. I believe I read something on snipershide or somewhere about it being durable compared to others that just mount on the rail.

Anyways, I just figured I'd ask. I notice that my cross hairs do cant sometimes when I shoot and I try to correct it. I didnt mount my scope, the gunsmith did here in my area. I'm thinking about remounting it though as sometimes when I look at it, it doesn't seem like it's perfectly horizontal. But then again, he's been doing his job a lot longer than I've been messing with scopes!

Thank you!

 

leveling the scope

George, you can get a straight level at most hardware stores for about 2-3 bucks and it will do the job if you have a bipod or a good rifle rest. You just need to have a level spot to put it on the rifle and take the scope caps off and put it on the top of the scope.

Oneeyedmac, If you have use of only one eye, there is an LED system that mounts around the eyepiece and is color coded to show you when you are level. I don't think it is practical for a tactical rifle, but for benchrest it seemed pretty neat. I came across it when I was researching the types of levels available. www.riflescopelevel.com

The edge to the U.S. Optics one is that it does fold to the side and it is made of metal. It seems a lot less likely to get snagged and snap off or break if the rifle gets between a rock and hard place. However if you have tactical turrets/parallax adjustment on your scope, they are about the same length out to the side as my B-Square level.

I hope this helps everyone. I am still interested in a U.S. Optics leveler for my main rifle, but I think the Falcon Scopes that are coming out will get my money first.

 

Also looks like it would stick out from the rifle quite a bit. I hate having hang-ups when in the woods or when putting the rifle in and out of the case, might also break easy with it sticking out so far. I'd like to see one that mounts under the rear of the scope somehow so it's under the eyepiece. Don't ask me how they'd make it work though . . .

-matt

I think the idea is to put that on the scope when mounting the scope the the rifle to get it level.....then take it off once your done. I didnt think it was to keep on the rifle while the rifle is in use.

 

Also looks like it would stick out from the rifle quite a bit. I hate having hang-ups when in the woods or when putting the rifle in and out of the case, might also break easy with it sticking out so far. I'd like to see one that mounts under the rear of the scope somehow so it's under the eyepiece. Don't ask me how they'd make it work though . . .

-matt

I think the idea is to put that on the scope when mounting the scope the the rifle to get it level.....then take it off once your done. I didnt think it was to keep on the rifle while the rifle is in use.

No, it is used for shooting. When you are on ground that is not level, and/or you have a swivel bipod, your rifle might be canted without your knowledge. This cant can cause a different POI. This particular device mounts to the scope because then the bubble is calibrated to the scope (which is what you want). It also states that it folds 90 degrees so that it doesnt stick out when you dont need it. It's also made out of metal so that if you're gradding it, it's less likely to break, unlike plastic.

Remember, USO usually makes good quality stuff. I doubt they'd try to make something cheap that would break or cause all kinds of problems. Anyways, if you click the link and read the description, it has some more stuff in there as well.

 

I use the USO level that bolts to the base and does not fold. It is very durable and the parallax knob provides it some shelter. It is very easy to use, just secure it to your base, level the rifle out according to the level, use a plumb line to level your reticule, then secure your scope. When in the field you can make oddly supported shots and ensure your cross hairs are level.

 

The more time I spend at 300 yards the more I want a level. I actually find that I try to line up my scope on the target stands to make sure I'm as close to vertical as possible. However I find that I normally have some right pull which either means my scope is tilted slightly or I have a slight tilt in the rifle. Given that I can pull either right or left depending on the day, I think it has more to do with my hold than anything else.

I'm a fan of the rail mounted version of the USO and given my SN-3 is so large anyway, I would likely go for the non-folding version. With the thread on cover I think it would be adequately protected.

 

The reason for the scope mounted version is due to the fact that your rail might not be level due to how it's positioned on the action. Also another thing that could cause an unlevel "bubble level" is seating of the level on the rail (whether or not there is a perfect square between the rail and the level you're putting on.)

If for some reason one of the above are not level, when you level your scope to a plumb line and your bore, your level might not be level to your scope (if that makes sense.)

One way I read to correct this, is to use shims under your bubble level, or file away at your level a little bit where it sits on the rails untill you get it where it should be.

If on the other hand you have a scope mounted level, you can just rotate the level untill it matches up to the scope while you're using a plumb line to level your scope to your bore.

I hope that made sense ... haha, sometimes I feel like I'm still confused Anyways, it's just something to try to provide a more accurate bubble. Some say it doesnt really even matter anyways as such a small tube cannot give a really accurate reading on whether something is level or not.

Half a dozen to one, 6 to another.

 

Ringo,

It actually would not matter if your bore was not in line with your scope. The worst it could be is a maximum of about 1/2" in the worst case scenario. This can be corrected for in windage adjustment. If your bubble level is lined up with your reticule, or the other way around, then your shots will not suffer from cant in the scope. This theory is very hard to describe in words, but I remember seeing a diagram of it explained.... I will search for and post a link.

 

That was quick......... here it is, you have to be a registered member to view it though.....

http://snipersparadise.com/sniperchat/i ... opic=10592

 

This thought just came to me... The USO level you posted about would come in handy when a scope will be moved from one rifle to another and you would not want to have to re-level it. Just level the reticule to the bubble level and your good to go!!!!

 

At nearly 100.00 though....I think I can make due for now without it.

That's my thought too...

I saw a post (somewhere) where a fellow made his own scope level using a bubble tube removed from a cheap level and drilled cross-ways through the bottom section of a spare scope ring. He then used a dab of epoxy to secure the bubble tube in the hole he drilled and viola! instant-scope level (for a couple bucks).

I have 3 bubble tubes I removed from a level I picked up at the .99-cent store and have some spare scope rings. I just need to get my butt off the Internet and go make the darn thing. :roll:

 

Nope

Definitly not needed.

Could it be useful on a benchrest rifle? Maybe.

Useful on a tactical rifle? Not really.

I have made plenty of cold-bore 900-1000 yard shots without one. It just takes attention to detail. Amazingly the human body comes equipped with two bubble levels. Mine work pretty well. Never needed another one on my rifle.

 

some more options ........

Basic ACDs (metal construction)
http://www.mountsplus.com/miva/merchant ... OP-A30-010

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... t=11082005

Electronic ACD
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... t=11082005

 

Any chance anyone has some USO rail mounted anticant indicators they could snap a few photos of?

 

This is the level my gun came with.

Whether it is useful or not I do not know as I don't have my scope yet. But I could see advantages to having it.

 

I used to snicker at the levels, might help the superanal in BR...

Now I have mellowed and see em as training wheels for beginner marksmen. Once you get some time in on the weapon ya can judge verticle and horizonal without a level, just use that personal computer holding that coolazz Boonie Hat up.

I guess it would help those who have an impaired sense of balance. I know its not a fun thing, but its called a learning curve for a very good reason. A little struggle makes the victory that much sweeter...

Gotta go, my microwave lunch is FINALLY ready... :wink:

 

Thanks for the pic.
If anyone else out there has one set up, please post some pictures.


And ya, I'll admit it... I'm a "beginner" when it comes to this kind of stuff. I just don't want to start off with bad habits, and I can see how the anti-cant devices can be frowned upon in the tactical community.

 

I ended up buying one of the U.S. Optics fixed levels from Midway USA. It is extremely well machined and the cap is screwed on the other side when not in use. I own the B-Square ones in the pic, but the quality is like night and day. If you are going to get one that you need to be durable, the U.S. Optics has no rival.

I don't do much actual "tactical shooting" since I became a civilian. I am not funded by a police department or the military, so shooting a couple hundred rounds a weekend is not an option for me to get as good as the guys here. I shoot targets for recreation and to see what my rig and I am capable of.

At long distances I don't shoot 18" steel torsos, I shoot 6inch Shoot N See targets so I can record my loads, conditions and adjustments to get on the bull.

I like my "training wheels" as it helps me be repeatable at longer distances. If I am shooting off a Harris with the swivel, I see how far off my judgement can be thinking I am level. If I were to remain canted, it has in the past cost me a few rounds to get it back on paper, even if I am only canted 2-5 degrees at 500+ yards. At almost $2/round for my GMM ammo, I have probably saved close to the $80 I would have spent in ammo in the last year or so to consistently get on paper. I realized, it wasn't usually the wind... it was the cant moving impact right or left in conjunction with the wind.

 

Not to worry, no doubt you will start off with MANY bad habits!!!

Is why getting some training in real world schools is sooo important. Havin a savvy Instructor get face down in the dirt with ya watching every move beats gizmos attached to the rifle at the local range. (Besides having positive feedback is great and no gizmo growls "Out-FREAKIN- standing, now do that again!")

In the grand scheme of things bein a tad canted under 300 is a minor nit in the world of bad habits... breath control and trigger pull, spotting strike through the rifle scope and anticipatin recoil are far bigger.

I know gizmo makers have bills to pay so I am not saying you shouldnt buy whatever gives ya confidence... but money spent learning from folks who know whats real and whats hype sure isnt money thrown out the window!!!

Its just oft times its far easier to order a gizmo than get the training...

Is why I bought a microwave n not a buncha pots, pans and a cookbook... :lol:

 

Anyone have a behind the scope view of the USO anticant devices? I'm debating on a rail mounted or scope mounted one. I'm just worried the scope mounted anticant device would block too much of the elevation knob.