[Mikeinajeep]

Nate and Orkan! Nice posts! For me, shooting really good groups is 80% dirt time and the rest is trigger. I have a really great rifle but without that 2 pound Jewell trigger my shooting goes to 10 moa.

 

[kinghq1]

I'm with CptnBlue.

I'm looking at the Model 700 SPS, either the Tactical or the Varmint, in the .308 flavor. I haven't used a Civilian LR in YEARS. Being a Vet my first choice is the .223, but I know that isn't necessarily practical for hunting big game. I use to hunt all the time growing up with my dad and now that my daughter is a teen, I want to get back into it as she has been excited to go to the range with me.

Sorry, back on topic.

I've looked into custom builds for the .308 and if I go that route, ER Shaw will be my supplier, E.R. Shaw Inc. | Mk. VII Rifle | Mk. VII VS Rifle | Shaw Precision Guns | E.R. Shaw Custom Barrels | Small Arms Manufacturing | Makers of Precision Gun Barrels and the E.R. Shaw Mk. VII Custom Bolt Action Rifle.

Nate - awesome post
Jarhead - awesome post

I'm ALWAYS open to suggestions and criticisms. The only way we learn is by asking questions, making mistakes and learning from both. I've reloaded pistol rounds for years, I need to get some .223 dies and eventually .308 when my search is over.

 

[teskymo]

The best thing you can do for accuracy is to carefully and thoroughly burn out the first barrel...

blah, blah, blah, et al.

What he said!

If you ask, five different shooters, what really makes a gun shoot the wings off a fly (through one hole) you'll get five different answers.

Yes a custom barrel will improve the groups, a new trigger will help, bedding, etc... The truth is all the things that make a reaaly good shooter, is you and your weapon becomming one "weapon" Of all the varibles that can and do contribute and hinder a shooter, probably the most important aspect is the individual. Having trained thousands of individuals to shoot booth rifle and pistols at the ranges, its amazing how many times, I've had someone on the line say, theres something wrong with the gun, or, its not sighted in, or what ever other excuse they can come up with too blame the gun. I'v taken it and shot X's every time.

Bottom line, take the time and effort, to learn and become one, with your rifle or pistol, and you'll shoot straight and true everytime period.

 

[Orkan]

I can get behind that... to a degree.

You can "be one with" a 1MOA rifle all you want, it won't magically turn into a 1/4MOA rifle.

 

[Mikeinajeep]

Lol! I was at the range today and discovered cold weather will make a 1/4 moa rifle into a 2-3 moa shooter. Ten rounds in we all gave up and made it "shotgun training day."

 

[Botts]

The best thing you can do for accuracy is to carefully and thoroughly burn out the first barrel...

4) Evaluate the trigger as it comes from the factory...possibly consider replacing with A) Arnold Jewell HVR set at 2-3 pounds, or (B) "improved remington" design aftermarket trigger like Timney. Choose option A if this is a rifle that will not see use in freezing conditions, if it will, consider one of the option "B" 2-lever designs.

10) At this point, let your riflesmith disassemble and evaluate the action. He/she will almost undoubtedly single-point remachine the threads, face the action, face the bolt, recut the rear lug surfaces, possibly retime extracton cam, possibly bush the firing pin (suggest this if you've had trouble with cratering on your primers), possibly ream the raceway and bush the bolt, possibly install a better extractor like a Sako...the list goes on. Take a look at Greg Tannel's (Gre-Tan) Info pages, and at Mike Roscoe's (Lousiana Precision) Truing Pages to get an idea of what CAN be done with a Remchester.

Replace the mainspring in the action at this point. You're 15,000 cycles and a barrel into the deal...she's tired, and ready for the recycle pile.

Evaluate other stock options, if they might suit your shooting style and purposes better. If needed, have your smith pillar and glass the rifle into a new stock, or do the same on the factory stock.
-Nate

Is anyone able, to give an update on these items from a Savage rifle perspective? I don't have a nearby gunsmith that specializes in precision rifles, much less Savage precision, so I would appreciate your thoughts on what needs to be done if I mail out my rifle.

 

[Orkan]

You need to call Travis at TS Customs. He'll get your bang stick whipped into shape quick fast and in a hurry.

605-870-1567

 

[natdscott]

Just remember, in life, you only get 2 of 3 choices: Good, Fast, and/or Cheap.

And Botts, that post really is not rifle specific. It could be a Krag, or a Kalash, or a Knights, and I'd say the same thing for the same reason.

-Nate

 

[retnavyshtr]

I agree with most of the advice given above. Yes this is only my second post but over thirty years ago when I first learned to shoot, I don't remember all the different things that were out there where you could modify your gun. You shot it as it came, out of the box, handed down to you whatever. It was all on you to learn the weapon, trigger pull, etc. Hunting and trapping was a daily thing and I learned from some good shooters(who didn't use scopes). After I joined the military, I learned from another individual who just recently past away. He taught me breathing control, reloading, and some finer points only after making me use a rotten shooting stick that wouldn't shoot straight. He said if I could learn to hit targets and various objects with that thing, I would be ready for a real weapon. At first I hated him, then learned to appreciate what he was teaching me. After shooting various guns, reloading and shooting about 1K rounds ea. a weekend I ended up a lot better than I was. So my only summary is first learn the gun that you are shooting with, if you can get out every bit of accuracy from that gun as is, then modify it. Most factory guns today are much more accurate than the shooters who get behind it.
I also agree with the above, nothing says more about how accurate a shooter is than when the targets are shooting back at you...I don't think anyone says I shot sub-moa on that one. Semper-Fi and Hooah to those of you out there.

 

[paperhunter]

Yes sir , when you heard bullet hit you , only run or defense whatever you had on your hand , salute to all man&women @ service ,
7 army southvietnam


Too young to die , too old too live in the battle field

 

[jude20]

Thanks for posting some knowledge, learning a lot from here/

 

[Maxheadspace]

Great response by Nate with excellent advice, although kind of a ten-year plan for getting your dream rifle.

Accuracy is consistency. The ability to put the round in the same place (relatively) shot after shot. So the objective is to improve consistency with both rifle and shooter.

I differ a bit with Nate in that unless the shooter is an old pro, he/she should work on tight shot groups immediately. I suppose this is slightly off topic, but In my opinion and experience, improving shooter habits yields faster accuracy results with less-seasoned shooters. The most accurate rifle in the world will only be as consistent as the person pulling the trigger.

The first piece of advice I always give to high power rifle shooters is to use the "ball and dummy" technique when working on their accuracy. Have someone else load your rifle (without you watching), mixing a dummy round randomly in with the live ammo. Of course when the trigger is pulled unknowingly on the dummy round, nothing happens in the chamber. But what does happen is that flinching, bad trigger control and anticipation become blatantly obvious to the shooter and anyone watching. There are a multitude of drills to improve shooter skills, but I've found the "ball and dummy" practice yields fast results. Only when cured of flinching, anticipation and poor trigger control will rifle accuracy mean anything.


Sent from my iPhone using Outdoor Forums

 

[natdscott]

Great response by Nate with excellent advice, although kind of a ten-year plan for getting your dream rifle.

It's more like a 10-year plan to being able to live up to your dream rifle...

-Nate

 

[BarbarianLou]

I become more amazed with each post I read on these forums. The wealth of knowledge and experience you all are willing to share, is a gift I for one can not explain my appreciation and respect for enough.

To anyone new to shooting, there is no quick and easy answer. Every platform is different, and there are differences between platforms of the same make. The correct answer will be the one you find for yourself. All the advice and expertise in the world, while it could lead you in the right direction, will not mean an answer is found until accuracy is proven.

In my humble opinion, as some others have stated in much detail, is you have to know yourself and your weapon. Only then can you make accurate modifications with success.

To illustrate, I will provide a very simple example. Some friends and I regularly meet up and drink on the weekends. We enjoy spending our time playing horse with air rifles.
Not expensive rifles mind you, more like the cheap 1 pump lever action Daisy BB gun. Hang with me here.

Now we all know the 1 pump Daisy is not a precise platform, nor is a Copperhead BB an accurate projectile. With that being said however, after many rounds of practice, at various levels of intoxication, some very remarkable levels of accuracy can be achieved. I can walk outside right now, and hit an electric wire between telephone poles, every time. First shot. I've funded my plinking habit for my 9mm Makarov winning money from bets doing this. The whole point is, I know that Daisy like the back of my hand, and more importantly I have the confidence to employ it without hesitation, anticipation, or subjugation.

Without the confidence in your skills and your knowledge, anything you modify to improve accuracy is just a guess, and a poorly informed guess at that. Regardless of the source.

 

[Sparky01]

This is a great read for anyone!!!!! Thanks for sharing everyone!!!!!

 

[chad19946]

This is perhaps the best post I have ever read! Very informative! Thanks!

 

[mike.h]

Thanks for resurrecting this thread. It's a great read.

And once again, Thanks Nate...

 

[paul van eijl]

Hello James,

Glass bedding is one of the best thinks i did with my Howa 1500 24" HB .308. In a Major Plaster stock. Before the results on the 100 meter ware 2 inch. After the glasbedding it is olmost one hole of 10 mm. (5 shots at 100 meter)

Paul

 

[schmuzzy]

its coincidental that this thread popped up.

"The best thing you can do for accuracy is to carefully and thoroughly burn out the first barrel..."

just took care of returning my rifle to Short Action Customs for a new barrel.


after almost a year of practice, load testing, a couple of instructions, and 1,673 rounds (groups starting to open up)...

I think I'm finally ready to start on a level (hopefully) commensurate with the new barrel.

 

[Digger756]

I don't know if I missed this tip or not but here goes.

When I was in the service an old Sargent of mine taught us about how to tune our trigger pull. He would lay a penny across the end of the barrel and have us dry fire until we could do it without the penny falling off. I didn't believe it could be done until after about 2 weeks of trying i could finally do it. LOL